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Post by planoaggie on Mar 11, 2023 11:56:36 GMT -5
Why? What has he done at Georgetown to make you think he would be successful at another school with even less resources? His team got hot for 5 days during the 2021 Big East Tournament and that was it. They went 7-25 the very next season. Every thing he did before and since that Big East tournament run was terrible. He is a terrible recruiter, terrible communicator and a terrible Xs and Os coach. The only reason you are advocating for Ewing is because you are still thinking about his playing days. I was curious about some of your criticism of Patrick Ewing, so I did some checking. 1. I can't speak to him being a terrible interviewer. 2. I can't speak to him being a terrible communicator. 3. He had a "bad not terrible" HC winning percentage at Georgetown which I already knew. In 6 seasons, he was 75-109 which amounts to 41%. 50% winning percentage to me is defined as okay or average. Anything below 40%, I consider terrible. 4. If you recently won a Power 5 basketball championship, you can coach, especially if your team is not loaded with talent. You said he is a terrible recruiter, so where did the talent come from. He must have coached them up to beat some talented teams in the Big East during their run. None of the other talented coaches were capable of making adjustments to defeat a terribly coached team? 5. Below are the 247 Recruit Basketball Team Rankings for Georgetown by years. The data goes against your comment that he is a terrible recruiter. He improved Georgetown's recruitment rankings over Thompson III last season. 2016 - 113 (Thompson III last season) 2017 - 44 (Ewing hired in April 2017, he went 15-15) 2018 - 31 (His best win record as a coach with these recruits, 19-14) 2019 - 54 2020 - 60 (Start of Covid) 2021 - 16 (After winning Big East Championship) 2022 - 53 I believe A&T fans and administrators would accept the above rankings, especially the big jumps in recruiting when he was 1st hired and after winning a championship. Here is some additional information on his recruiting success/failure. Transfers and a player leaving early for pro hurt him. basketballrecruiting.rivals.com/news/patrick-ewing-s-five-highest-ranked-recruits-at-georgetownAs I stated, name recognition and winning championships help in recruiting. Currently, we have neither. I am fine if we don't hire Ewing as our next coach. No stake in the game. I just want us to do the best job possible in hiring a good coach and to think out of the box. We had an entire season to get this right. Again Ewing may not want to coach any longer or his salary maybe way too high. Just a theory or fantasy by me. 🤔🙂 |
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Post by bigpeete1 on Mar 11, 2023 12:42:38 GMT -5
Ewing and MJ are the best of friends never say never' Ewing could not recruit the DMV
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Post by planoaggie on Mar 11, 2023 12:56:57 GMT -5
Ewing and MJ are the best of friends never say never' Ewing could not recruit the DMV I know this as well. He coach for Charlotte and Orlando NBA teams for many years. Plus Ewing has connections to pull Bigs (national and international) which we badly need. Think of his many tall Georgetown friends who may know players that are mid-major talent but not Georgetown caliber players. Just fun discussions. |
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Post by Bornthrilla on Mar 11, 2023 13:04:11 GMT -5
5. Below are the 247 Recruit Basketball Team Rankings for Georgetown by years. The data goes against your comment that he is a terrible recruiter. He improved Georgetown's recruitment rankings over Thompson III last season. 2016 - 113 (Thompson III last season) 2017 - 44 (Ewing hired in April 2017, he went 15-15) 2018 - 31 (His best win record as a coach with these recruits, 19-14) 2019 - 54 2020 - 60 (Start of Covid) 2021 - 16 (After winning Big East Championship) 2022 - 53 I believe A&T fans and administrators would accept the above rankings, especially the big jumps in recruiting when he was 1st hired and after winning a championship. Here is some additional information on his recruiting success/failure. Transfers and a player leaving early for pro hurt him. basketballrecruiting.rivals.com/news/patrick-ewing-s-five-highest-ranked-recruits-at-georgetownAnd where is John Thompson III coaching now? The only reason he got the job is the same reason Patrick Ewing got the job: their name and nostalgia. Patrick Ewing benefitted from his own celebrity and the Georgetown brand when he first came back to DC. He recruited a top player whose mom I went to middle school with. As soon as that player realized how much Ewing was in over his head, he quickly decommited and went to Michigan. Same with Matt McClung. That dude lasted one year before he had to leave the Ewing clown show. Now Ewing can't get any top players to consider Georgetown. |
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Post by planoaggie on Mar 11, 2023 14:30:40 GMT -5
And where is John Thompson III coaching now? The only reason he got the job is the same reason Patrick Ewing got the job: their name and nostalgia. Patrick Ewing benefitted from his own celebrity and the Georgetown brand when he first came back to DC. He recruited a top player whose mom I went to middle school with. As soon as that player realized how much Ewing was in over his head, he quickly decommited and went to Michigan. Same with Matt McClung. That dude lasted one year before he had to leave the Ewing clown show. Now Ewing can't get any top players to consider Georgetown. I respect your opinion, but feel Ewing's head coaching career is not over if he wishes to still coach. Thompson III had 2 bites at the apple as HC (Princeton then Georgetown) before he was finished. Ewing could just do it in reverse (High-major to a mid-major). All schools have some level of issues, especially when it comes to recruiting. I have a friend that can't stand a particular coach/school because they would not offer the player/family a competitive large NIL deal compared to another school, so they decommited. That team went on to finish in the top 20 nationally in NCAA D1 football the last 2 years. Therefore, when he talks about that coach or school I know he is a little bias based on his personal experience. |
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oleschoolaggie
Official BDF member
2009 Poster of the Year, 2009 Most Knowledgeable Poster
Posts: 22,758
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Mar 11, 2023 15:58:45 GMT -5
It took Ewing forever to get a head coaching job partly because he does not interview well. The only school willing to give him a chance was his alma mater. Ewing is not getting any more chances after this disaster. Let's see. He may not even want to continue coaching at the college level. This was his 1st HC job. Maybe he takes all the experience and mistakes that you pointed out in your earlier post and channel it into lessons learned where the next college that hires him benefits in getting a much better coach, leader, and recruiter. As others have mentioned, coaches are recycled and sometimes a new start elsewhere leads to success. How good of a player he was only matters to me in name recognition for player and staff recruitment. A&T has not been relevant in basketball since 2013. Its last MEAC Championship and at-large NCAA bid. Our fans traveled well in certain arenas, but what we have been doing on the court as a team these past years is not threatening. Some good competitive teams, but not championship caliber teams. You can't recruit very good players with nothing to show for it (titles) or money these days (NIL). It is even harder to hold onto good talent due to NIL and the NCAA rule that allows players to transfer 1 time without the penalty of sitting out. We need to do something drastically different and I felt that name recognition of a former NBA player might due the trick. Otherwise, hire an experienced HC or assistant coach from a good coaching tree or winning program at the CAA or higher level as to competition. That's if you are trying to win now. Go get a good young talented HC or assistant coach at any level if we want to experiment with a project and feel that we don't necessarily need to win right now, but build towards a good program. Having an entire season to hire a coach does not come around often, so I would think that we would be aggressive to try and win now. jerry eaves had a nationally recognized celebrity "name", how did that workout for a&t? how many big time recruits did he sign? butch beard, former nba head coach and player, coached at both howard university and morgan state, how'd that workout at those schools? juan dixon, former nba player and march madness national championship at umd, coaches at coppin state, how's that working out? i mean, i could go on and on... Sent from my SM-G950U using proboards |
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Post by DOOMS on Mar 11, 2023 18:45:54 GMT -5
Ewing would be a bad idea, period.
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Post by planoaggie on Mar 11, 2023 19:38:43 GMT -5
jerry eaves had a nationally recognized celebrity "name", how did that workout for a&t? how many big time recruits did he sign? butch beard, former nba head coach and player, coached at both howard university and morgan state, how'd that workout at those schools? juan dixon, former nba player and march madness national championship at umd, coaches at coppin state, how's that working out? i mean, i could go on and on... Sent from my SM-G950U using proboards I don't want to spend a lot of time discussing a candidate the administrators may not be seriously considering and would like to move to discussing other candidates, but I don't see how listing former NBA players you feel failed as coaches mean that all NBA players fate will be the same. We know that is not the case. I do know that being a great player does not guarantee that you will make a good/great coach. I believe we agree on that statement. Although some may disagree with me on what I am calling a high bar, but based on A&T's last 5 seasons and not winning a conference championship or an at-large NCAA bid since 2013 (Cy Alexander) "my" goal or high bar for any new coach to achieve success is winning a conference championship or an at-large NCAA bid. 10 years is a long time for a basketball school, as some on this forum has claimed, to not achieve either goal. I believe A&T is now primarily a football school. Patrick Ewing has achieved my goal at his first stop as a HC, so who is to say he can't do it again at A&T. But again, he may not do well. Ewing does have a much greater name recognition than those you listed which "may" attract better or more recruits at the mid-major level. Beard, who you mentioned, achieved my goal in 1992 with Howard. Surprisingly, if Howard had not won the MEAC Championship today (Congratulations!!), he would have coached their last MEAC championship team. Jerry Eaves, who you also mentioned, did not meet my criteria during his tenure at A&T, but the team was so bad back then that A&T felt he did a good job as their coach. Taken from the below link. "Eaves took over a one-win program with just four returning players and two scholarship players and turned it into a team that consistently contends among the top teams in the MEAC." ncataggies.com/sports/mens-basketball/roster/coaches/jerry-eaves/124Two famous saying come to mind: "One man's success is another man's failure" or vice-versa and "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder". Fortunately or unfortunately, I have no say on who is interviewed or hired. |
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Post by aggie2039 on Mar 11, 2023 19:41:14 GMT -5
Fortunately 😆😅
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Post by planoaggie on Mar 11, 2023 19:55:24 GMT -5
Coincidentally, while watching Tulane vs Memphis game, the commentators mentioned that Wichita State had just fired men's basketball Coach Isaac Brown after three seasons. They went on to say that NIL and the transfer portal has caused some good coaches to be fired and that the NCAA was not prepared for both of these rules to coexist at the same time. It resulted in too much player movement and coach adjustments from year to year. I mentioned this 2 posts ago. Some coaches labeled bad coaches may only need to learn how to better navigate the NIL and transfer portal to become successful.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Mar 11, 2023 20:24:10 GMT -5
You've gotta increase your expectations. Why do you want all of these failed coaches to come and learn on the job at A&T?
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Post by planoaggie on Mar 11, 2023 20:52:31 GMT -5
You've gotta increase your expectations. Why do you want all of these failed coaches to come and learn on the job at A&T? I am not sure your post was for me, but I believe I only mentioned Ewing by name as a candidate for the A&T HC position. I said we could target good coaches at different levels depending on whether we want to win now or build slowly. I admitted earlier that I am not good at knowing a lot about coaches background, so I tend to stay out of the coaching recommendation discussions. 🙂 In my response to Oleschoolaggie, he mentioned 3 coaches he felt failed. I showed that in some people's eyes they had limited success, but was not nominating them for the A&T position. Isaac Brown name was mentioned by the commentators in a discussion about NIL and transfer portal and that some coaches are going to have to learn how to coach in this new era. I don't know anything about him, other than him being an African American coach that was fired today, to nominate him for the A&T job. |
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Post by aggierattler on Mar 12, 2023 11:02:10 GMT -5
You've gotta increase your expectations. Why do you want all of these failed coaches to come and learn on the job at A&T?
Just about everyone here has said that they don't want any "old retread" coaches.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Mar 12, 2023 11:07:29 GMT -5
It's the failed coaches who shouldn't get a chance to learn on the job at A&T. If you failed at your last stop that had more resources, why should we think you would suddenly have success here with less resources.
Why can't we just hire a coach who was successful at his last job?
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Post by aggie2039 on Mar 12, 2023 11:07:50 GMT -5
A&T administration does a good job of keeping information on potential hires out of the news.
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