trues
Official BDF member
Posts: 4,367
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Post by trues on Sept 13, 2010 9:01:39 GMT -5
Most of you may not remember but I have always had a concern about our OL. Our guys are just to small upfront. Norfok DL average 320 vs A&T 260. Our season is going to be what the preseason projected we going to finish around 6th place.
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Post by ohsixrain on Sept 13, 2010 9:12:42 GMT -5
I don't think that really matters if you use the o-line correctly. Undersized o-lineman have to be able to get out and run....I don't know if we've run a play when our o-lineman have to pull and lead a running back around a corner. Then there's the stretch play....this play was perfected by the Denver Broncos in '97 & '98 and they had one of the smallest offensive lines in the league. But they could run and they did alot of cut blocking. What is our offensive philosophy? Is is power, speed, mis-direction what? Someone explain to me. What does this offense do well? What is it known mostly for? Maybe I'm looking at the wrong thing.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Sept 13, 2010 9:19:40 GMT -5
I think right now we are just running plays to set up our punting game.
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Post by treese on Sept 13, 2010 9:30:16 GMT -5
I think right now we are just running plays to set up our punting game. LOL!!!!! |
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Post by Bigboy on Sept 13, 2010 9:50:58 GMT -5
I think the OL gave Morgan enough time to pass, he just can't get the job done. As far as the running game, Mayhew was tipping and not taking advantage of the few small cracks that were being open in the line. When you have an OL that is not opening big holes in the line you need to use RB's with power that might have a chance of breaking some tackles. The OL is what it is unless some miracle happens and they all of a sudden become great for the rest of the season, but until that happens (right!) we have to adjust the game plan. Mayhew is not running with the passion he ran with last season.
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oleschoolaggie
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Posts: 25,256
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 14, 2010 11:25:01 GMT -5
wow, some of ya'll just don't understand the value of having a true qb like kindle in the lineup. a healthy kindle changes the game completely. pass blocking becomes easier because kindle reads the defense, releases his passes quicker than our backups, and "accurately" passes the ball. thus, run blocking becomes easier because our opponents can't stack 8 in the box with the threat of a qb who can burn you if you do. i think some of ya'll are just over thinking our offensive woes.
and regarding our o-line, who ever said we'd have a "dominant" o-line this season? because if we don't, ain't no way in hail we're gonna be able to run the ball with 8 helmets in the friggin' box! some of ya'll don't understand. when there's 8 in the box, there are no gaps to run through! zero! that's why we can't run the ball. we only have 5 offensive linemen on the field. how in the hail are they suppose to move out 8 defenders?
its totally untrue that a team can still run the ball when the opponent knows you can't pass. the only way you can do that is by having a "mammoth" of an offensive line (which we don't have) and at least 2 starting quality running backs (which we don't have). we don't have the hogs like the redskins had back in the riggins days. they could run no matter what because their o-line was bigger and stronger than any d-line in the league and they had 2 starting quality running backs. not to mention, they could also pass the ball.
lot's times, we here at bdv tend to oversimplify stuff. its easy to point the finger at the oc. you can have the best oc on the planet, but without quality personnel to execute with (particularly qb), it just ain't gonna work...
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oleschoolaggie
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2009 Poster of the Year, 2009 Most Knowledgeable Poster
Posts: 25,256
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 14, 2010 11:27:23 GMT -5
Mayhew is not running with the passion he ran with last season. unlike last year, mayhew doesn't have a quality backup (payne) who can keep him fresh for an entire game. basically, mayhew is getting all of the carries... |
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Post by bseballaggie on Sept 14, 2010 11:36:31 GMT -5
I don't think that really matters if you use the o-line correctly. Undersized o-lineman have to be able to get out and run....I don't know if we've run a play when our o-lineman have to pull and lead a running back around a corner. Then there's the stretch play....this play was perfected by the Denver Broncos in '97 & '98 and they had one of the smallest offensive lines in the league. But they could run and they did alot of cut blocking. What is our offensive philosophy? Is is power, speed, mis-direction what? Someone explain to me. What does this offense do well? What is it known mostly for? Maybe I'm looking at the wrong thing. Denver Broncos used zoned blocking on their offensive line, this could help our run game greatly right now!! The zone scheme is designed to create organized chaos at the LOS. The location of the running lanes are impossible for the D to predict from play to play. This variability strains the flexibility of every defensive system, making the location of run fits more difficult to predict and preparation more complex. It challenges the mental discipline of the defense, which is particularly difficult for college defenses, who often depend on athletic talent alone. It increases the likelihood of an error leading to a large gain. Fear of such errors can make the defense less aggressive and give the initiative to the O-line; or can make the defense too aggressive, allowing better cut back lanes for the diligent runner. Just as QBs who are able to run through progressions are more successful in today's game than QBs who run a set play, the zone system gives a quality runner, the man with the best view of the action, decision making power to choose from multiple options dictated by his reads. |
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oleschoolaggie
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2009 Poster of the Year, 2009 Most Knowledgeable Poster
Posts: 25,256
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 14, 2010 11:44:55 GMT -5
Denver Broncos used zoned blocking on their offensive line, this could help our run game greatly right now!! there are no running lanes to predict defensively when you have 8 in the box because all of the lanes are plugged with defenders. zone blocking goes nowhere with 8 in the box. until we can force teams to respect our passing, ain't no scheme on the planet gonna correct our running woes... |
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Post by bseballaggie on Sept 14, 2010 11:53:31 GMT -5
Denver Broncos used zoned blocking on their offensive line, this could help our run game greatly right now!! there are no running lanes to predict defensively when you have 8 in the box because all of the lanes are plugged with defenders. zone blocking goes nowhere with 8 in the box. until we can force teams to respect our passing, ain't no scheme on the planet gonna correct our running woes... This is not true zone blocking is designed to beat eight men in the box, traditional blocking requires that lineman focuses on one individual to block this is why eight in the box is effective, zone blocking closes or restricts the secondary defense entry zones in the run and creates a crease for the runner  I believe there are three important principles of zone running. First, deny penetration. Second, re-establish the line of scrimmage. Third, render the playside linebacker ineffective. The ultimate goal is to stretch the defense laterally, providing secure creases for the runner. |
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Post by bseballaggie on Sept 14, 2010 11:56:56 GMT -5
Mayhew is not running with the passion he ran with last season. unlike last year, mayhew doesn't have a quality backup (payne) who can keep him fresh for an entire game. basically, mayhew is getting all of the carries... BULLSH...... |
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Post by Bornthrilla on Sept 14, 2010 12:40:33 GMT -5
There is no way our coaches can teach this offensive line how to properly zone block.
It's hard enough to accomplish that in the pro ranks.
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oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 14, 2010 13:05:52 GMT -5
there are no running lanes to predict defensively when you have 8 in the box because all of the lanes are plugged with defenders. zone blocking goes nowhere with 8 in the box. until we can force teams to respect our passing, ain't no scheme on the planet gonna correct our running woes... This is not true zone blocking is designed to beat eight men in the box, traditional blocking requires that lineman focuses on one individual to block this is why eight in the box is effective, zone blocking closes or restricts the secondary defense entry zones in the run and creates a crease for the runner I believe there are three important principles of zone running. First, deny penetration. Second, re-establish the line of scrimmage. Third, render the playside linebacker ineffective. The ultimate goal is to stretch the defense laterally, providing secure creases for the runner. okay, you can believe it if you want. but there is no blocking scheme that allows 5 or 6 o-linemen to block 8 defenders. how do you stretch "8" defenders laterally with 5 or 6 o-linemen? zone blocking isn't capable of blocking 8 defenders with 5 or 6 o-linemen. if so, everybody would do it. no matter if you're zone blocking or not, you still have to fundamentally account for 8 defenders with at least 2 "fewer" blockers. what happens to the 2 or 3 defenders that you don't block? you think they're gonna just go away on vacation? zone blocking "alone" won't beat 8 in the box. there's 2 ways to beat 8 in the box. you either beat it over the top by taking advantage of 1-on-1 pass coverage, or you "smash mouth" the ball down their throats with a dominant o-line and hard nosed running back. that's how you beat 8 in the box. i dunno, maybe you know more about zone blocking than i do. but i've never seen zone blocking as a scheme take away the defensive advantage of having more helmets in the box than you do... |
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oleschoolaggie
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2009 Poster of the Year, 2009 Most Knowledgeable Poster
Posts: 25,256
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 14, 2010 13:12:48 GMT -5
unlike last year, mayhew doesn't have a quality backup (payne) who can keep him fresh for an entire game. basically, mayhew is getting all of the carries... BULLSH...... what do you mean? in the 2 games against wssu and nsu, mayhew has been the only running back to carry the ball more than 1 carry. the "only" other running back to carry the ball in 2 games is larry raper and he only carried it 1 time. so what are you trying to say? |
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Post by thefriscotxaggie on Sept 14, 2010 13:21:17 GMT -5
good break down oldscoohlaggie. But I will say it does not take an offensive guru to figure out we need to give someboy other than Mayhew some carries. That's no reflection on Mayhew but he needs a break during the game and a different running style will mix it up at least a little for the def.
Either the decision to only run Mayhew is just foolish or the Coaches dont trust the others to hang onto the ball
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