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Post by krazykev on Aug 17, 2007 12:51:49 GMT -5
He took a lot of the fun out of the band that was tradition. He has surround himself with a some staff that very soft and have never step in the program or any program. This director wants do everything different from what the machine stood for in the past. Now I know that every director has their own vision but, when you marched in the same program you took over is different. The proof is in the pudding and he was on his way out when Renick was still here. When Renick left that saved him cause his contract was up.
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Maxell
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Post by Maxell on Aug 17, 2007 13:00:50 GMT -5
So what is it that the band director is doing or not doing that causes discord. I do not pretend to know what is happening but I definitely know what can happen. For HBCU bands, band is sport. That means that all things that relate to direct competion apply. Those bands that respected must not only be prepared musically, they must possess an edge, a fierceness, a drive to be the best whether it be at a parade, exhibition or game. Those characteristics stem directly from the band director and no one else. If it's there, it shows in a certain swagger that you can see and that you can also hear in the music. The current edition of the B&GMM doesn't yet have it. Musically, the group has been good. But the rest is not there. I hate the fact that they march straight up, no upper body movement whatsoever. Boring!!!! Players can't feel the music marching that style. You can't have fun. All of that comes from the Director. Does he count off like Leonard Bernstein or James Brown? It makes a difference. If you take the spirit of Virgina State's BD and the musicality of our staff, then you'd have a band! Hopefully, Ruff will fix it and not be a-hole about it. There are things the students want to do that won't be allowed. Some student leaders are very frustrated but just trying to hang in there.
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Maxell
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Post by Maxell on Aug 17, 2007 14:08:34 GMT -5
As a former military officer I read it. Now, tell me where is the comparison besides in peoples heads. It will be tough if you've never marched but I'll give it a shot. The first thing to realize is that for HBCUs, marching band is war. It is school against school. Just like sport, to the players they are competing against the other team and as a spectator we are entertained by that. So before I can go any farther, you have to embrace the idea that there is fierce competition between bands thus the term "Battle of the Bands". In Chapter One Sun Tzu talks about the five factors of taking the field and the seven considerations for winning and defeat. I will apply these as best I can to HBCU band. The five factors in taking the field are moral law, heaven, earth, the commander, method and discipline. Moral law implies that the band has to have complete trust in the director and his ability to produce a superior performance that will both entertain the crowd and defeat the opposing band. I had a band director that would always say "Trust me" referring to his ability to deliver a winning show. Although heaven and earth have less of an application, it does apply. In planning an away trip it is critical to get an understanding of the stadium, seating and other factors when going up against and opposing band. In addition, the band must be prepared for any conditions. If the field is muddy, have a plan. If asked to do a post game show, have a plan. If it's raining have a plan. Band directors that do not prepare properly end up being embarassed if the other band is. I've been on both sides of that. The commander (band director) must be beyond reproach with wisdom and skill. Method and discipline must be used to produce excellence and applied appropriately to every band member. One member marching slightly different can mess up a whole rank. Individual strengths and weaknesses must be recognized and applied to entire band and it's performance. As for the seven considerations of winning and losing: 1) Which school has the best exhibition of spirit/pride (Moral Law)? The band and it's director must have the spirit of the school not vice versa. For A&T, the band must be a refection of the student body and culture, not create it's own. 2) Which of the two band directors (generals) has the most ability? A good band director will assess his competition. How does he structure his shows? Which type of music does his like? How good is he? How is he staffed? 3) Which band(army) has environmental advantages? Is there anything about the home field that can be exploited. Acoustics? Seating? 4) On which side has discipline been most rigorously enforced? This is so critical in band. Both the audience and the opposing band can tell if you are an undisciplined unit. 5) Which band (army) is stronger? Building a strong band with the type of instrumentation and skill is very important. It doesn't matter if you have 300 instruments and 200 of them are clarinets. 6) On which side are the officers and their men more highly trained? Bandsmen must be trained both the skills of their instrument as well as how the blend well in the ensemble. In addition, marching skills are just as critical and requires just as much focus. 6) In which band (army) is there a greater constancy for reward and punishment? The band director must be consistent in making sure the band knows what's important and have a system of reward and punishment to reinforce that. All of these Art of War principles apply to great bands. To mediocre ones you will not find evidence of any of these principles being applied. Most recently, Dr. Hodge made these principles real for members of The Machine and the band excelled in competition and in performance. If you've ever see the tape of "The Machine" standing nose to nose with "100" in Bragg seemingly physically out-gunned alternating playing songs in every style, you'd appreciate the WAR called band. WINNING is a state of mind. Just like athletic teams, great bands and their directors have a winning spirit. I'm not sure we have that now. Being good is not enough you have to want to win!
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truth
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Post by truth on Aug 18, 2007 0:22:44 GMT -5
I mean the band was basically on autopilot when Ruff got the job. All he had to do is clean some of the spots off of the diamond that was already formed. Basically don't F it up...what he do?....F it up!
He pushed away alot of the people who were working to keep the band going in the direction it was suppose to be going. 03 Vegas was suppose to be the start of the new era of domination. It ended up being the peak of the "Beast era" of the Machine.
In my eyes, the Machine died after the 2004 season ended and have gone on as the Marching Aggie Band. Soon, even that won't be left standing.
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Maxell
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Post by Maxell on Aug 18, 2007 0:37:28 GMT -5
Soon, even that won't be left standing. That won't happen!
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Post by krazykev on Aug 18, 2007 6:10:04 GMT -5
This is very true. Hit me on PM I will explain
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Gator
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Post by Gator on Aug 18, 2007 10:43:27 GMT -5
I do appreciate you taking time out to explain your point of view. I must say you really did a good job clarifying your points. In my effort to adopt the idea that band is a sport, I do recognize and agree with a lot of the points made.
Now, as any leader will tell you, he's in charge. The ship will go in the direction they choose. Based on some of the comments, it seems the band director wants to move things in a different direction. Most times change initial effect is difficult. Right now it doesn't seem as though he's getting the support from some members and alumni. I'm sure he expected it, but if his vision takes things in a different direction then we all have to live with. As you know from reading the art of war you get ride of those who are distractions. I wouldn't want people around me either that's trying sabotage my plan.
I myself personally can't stand quitters, especially when they're quiting because they can't get their way!
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Maxell
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Post by Maxell on Aug 18, 2007 16:47:30 GMT -5
Now, as any leader will tell you, he's in charge. The ship will go in the direction they choose. Thanks. I agree. Remember this is his 5th season. Any ship he needed to turn should have already turned by now. His upperclassmen came in at the beginning of his reign and they are the ones that are disgruntled. These should not be issues in your 5th season. He had nearly 120 freshmen in 2004. The leader has to be in alignment with the institution's commander in chief and embody the spirit of the school itself. We'll see what happens when Dr. Battle sorts things out. As always, AGGIE PRIDE!
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Post by Gator on Aug 18, 2007 21:05:51 GMT -5
AGGIE PRIDE!
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Post by AggieMike on Aug 18, 2007 21:19:30 GMT -5
Simple answer. Give band scholarships, you'll have band members. I know people who were drunk off the allure of the B&GMM but when to NCCU because Central gives full rides to band members, NOBODY in the band gets a dime. So I don't blame Ruff or the students who said "F*uck the bullsh*t, cut the check and I'll march" Pride only goes so far people. How many athletes would be here and go through that grind if they weren't getting anything for it?
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Post by krazykev on Aug 18, 2007 21:33:30 GMT -5
Aggie Mike, We have never had scholarships in the past....maybe book allowances, which is the same as now. We were there strictly out of LOYALTY to the program. The problem is the band director and the problem will stay there until the band director is gone! Trust me, I know. I used to be a staff member through the last years of Doc's regime and I assisted with the transition during the 1st year of the current regime....but that was ONLY out of LOYALTY!! Yeah, it's true, if you had scholarships, more kids would march, but that is the only reason they would march. As I said in an earlier post. The band is going to L.A. and in the past everybody and they momma would be trying to march just to take the trip. If you have to put flyers out and beg students to march, something is wrong. Golden Delight just lost 17 or so girls and had to put out signs to publicize auditions today.
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Maxell
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Post by Maxell on Aug 18, 2007 23:06:18 GMT -5
How the hell do you lose 17 girls?
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Post by DOOMS on Aug 21, 2007 10:29:41 GMT -5
I agree with AggieMike on the scholarship issue. I have a buddy from Tallahassee who played the quads and inquired about the band when he first got to A&T. He said Hell Naw when he found out all playing in the band would get him was book money. That's a hell of an undertaking to do for "fun."
It's not 1970 anymore. It's not 19anything. Kids today ain't the same. There are so many distractions and ways to entertain yourself there needs to be more than the allure of playing in the band to get them to join up. Yes, the band director is most-likely part of the problem but if the kids were getting a free or reduced-cost education NONE of these threads would be open.
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Post by blessedaggie84 on Aug 21, 2007 10:46:45 GMT -5
You loose 17 girls because most of them did not really know what they were getting into..the heat may have been a part of it also, alot of kids will quit something because it required some work. To add on to what KrazyKev said kids were coming to T to play the songs from previous years..songs like Velvet Rope and Torture to name a few were bringing in kids..I really dont believe Dr. Ruff is using all avenues to recruit students at all..Scholarships are a way but songs played will bring in kids along with more campus involvement and student involvement during games.
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Maxell
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Post by Maxell on Aug 21, 2007 11:02:15 GMT -5
Yes, the band director is most-likely part of the problem but if the kids were getting a free or reduced-cost education NONE of these threads would be open. I disagree. Scholarships are important but wasn't most of the football team on scholarship in 2004 and 2005 when this board was hot? It's Leadership not Scholarship.
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