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Post by da1andonle on Oct 30, 2007 21:42:24 GMT -5
Ok I see two prolems with this argument...
1. Since when does the quality of your atlehtic program determine the "Greatness" of your School?
Popularity maybe but Greatness by no means, A&T was founded to give African Americans a CHANCE to gain a higher education with the hopes that they would go backe to thier communities and help others, not only by thier donations but by spending time to build better communities. Somwhere in time that was forgotten. I see kids daily that have no choice but a hbcu, because they need sompne to give them an oppurtunity to do better. These kids, like some adults, get caught in the hype of Winning athletics. Being on TV week in and week out does help enrollment, it gives you an oppurtunity for your University to be in the public eye. But what makes great universities is whe graduates return in the form of internships research oppurtunities, things that hlp gin life expirence not how many dollars you donate.
2. Nobody mentionsed that most of us come from sub-standard communities and schools, and the values that are learned by growing up in this kind of enviroment. .
Its hard for these things to be broken, for examlpe, you said you make 100 plus a year but you only donate 1000. Thats cool but think of the advantage a student could gain by having the summer to work with you, learning and applying real life job skills, or if thats not possible teach a class on what you do and how you appprently do it so well. I teach high school business ed in Guliford County. Every time I have an oppurtunity to get a student teacher from T I take it because I know I may be able to help tht aggie be better. and Maybe they can influence others to do the same.
But I geuss a university founded to help a second class of people will never be put in the same category that a university founded for the elite. Thats just not what its about. Now do we have our problems yes, but the problems we have are much larger than anything on campus they are a reflection of east greensboro the schools that feed a&T and the black community as a whole you and myself included.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Oct 30, 2007 22:11:04 GMT -5
How to win friends on bluedeathvalley.com ... LOL
For the record, I am a product of A&T and I think most people would agree that I am one of the five or six smartest people on this planet.
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Freeze
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Post by Freeze on Oct 30, 2007 22:24:59 GMT -5
The post itself is flawed.
Yes there are numerous problems and issues with HBCU's. TRUST me, white and Black students who attend white schools have some of the same stories about serious concerns that they have at their institutions (lack of support, large classes with little interaction with professors, limited opportunities for diversity or cultural expression...especially if you are Black). I spent 8 years attending a PWI and have had several friends who attended them. They have their issues too.
BUT GUESS WHAT...THATS NOT THE POINT.
The point is, your post is soooooo broad and so loaded with self hate, that it skews any important critique that you may have on the efficiency of Black colleges...namely A&T.
Think about it. You entitled your post: "A&T is a sub-standard university." On top of that, you posted this in the A&T football section; not the Campus News or Just Chillin section. You were very scattered with your assesment...moving from our losing streak, to the need for A&T to merge with UNC-G, to administrators stealing money, to the lack of parking. You even tried to defend your blackness by stating how dark you and your wife are. And this is supposed to generate intelligent discussion??
I have chimed in on past threads that have talked about what we need to do differently from an administrative point of view on campus. But they were not eratic and misplaced threads in the wrong forum. They were groups of Aggies coming together to discuss and even sometimes disagree about the legacy of the civil rights movement, the current state of Black America, and the occasional failures of past and current administrators.
Like Dooms said, we have all been frustrated about time spent on campus (i.e. lack of resources, inefficiency, and sometimes even incompetence). However, I think we are all secure in the fact that our alma mater made us the men and women we are today and we can reflect on both the good, bad, and ugly aspects of our previous education.
I would hope that with a college degree, you can go back and reasses your post and think about its content and its placement. There is nothing wrong with being critical...but your critique boders upon a vicious and racist attack that conjures up emotions rooted in history; a history that would gladly do away with one of Black America's most precious commodities...HBCU's.
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Freeze
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Post by Freeze on Oct 30, 2007 23:06:11 GMT -5
The post itself is flawed. Yes there are numerous problems and issues with HBCU's. TRUST me, white and Black students who attend white schools have some of the same stories about serious concerns that they have at their institutions (lack of support, large classes with little interaction with professors, limited opportunities for diversity or cultural expression...especially if you are Black). I spent 8 years attending a PWI and have had several friends who attended them. They have their issues too. BUT GUESS WHAT...THATS NOT THE POINT. The point is, your post is soooooo broad and so loaded with self hate, that it skews any important critique that you may have on the efficiency of Black colleges...namely A&T. Think about it. You entitled your post: "A&T is a sub-standard university." On top of that, you posted this in the A&T football section; not the Campus News or Just Chillin section. You were very scattered with your assesment...moving from our losing streak, to the need for A&T to merge with UNC-G, to administrators stealing money, to the lack of parking. You even tried to defend your blackness by stating how dark you and your wife are. And this is supposed to generate intelligent discussion?? I have chimed in on past threads that have talked about what we need to do differently from an administrative point of view on campus. But they were not eratic and misplaced threads in the wrong forum. They were groups of Aggies coming together to discuss and even sometimes disagree about the legacy of the civil rights movement, the current state of Black America, and the occasional failures of past and current administrators. Like Dooms said, we have all been frustrated about time spent on campus (i.e. lack of resources, inefficiency, and sometimes even incompetence). However, I think we are all secure in the fact that our alma mater made us the men and women we are today and we can reflect on both the good, bad, and ugly aspects of our previous education. I would hope that with a college degree, you can go back and reasses your post and think about its content and its placement. There is nothing wrong with being critical...but your critique boders upon a vicious and racist attack that conjures up emotions rooted in history; a history that would gladly do away with one of Black America's most precious commodities...HBCU's. No self hatred here Freeze. Your post is interesting though. I only apologize for taking you to a place where you can't control your anger. Please know that the post is erratic because it's a 2-hour conversation condensed into a couple of paragraphs! I apologize for it's substandard composition. LMAO. Other folks have said that about some of my post before. Trust me friend...you dont anger me at all. Why?? I dont know you and probably will never meet you. Folks invest too much energy into this internet thing. I like ideas...which probably explains my line of work. I also will gladly and unemotionally tell you when I think your idea or post stinks. We can agree to disagree and I can go back to reading, talking to my wife, or watching t.v. and never think about it again...until I log on to see what some fellow Aggies have posted. Dont take it personal...I dont.
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Gator
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Post by Gator on Oct 31, 2007 13:11:11 GMT -5
Folks,
This brother is a fraud. We should not allow his post to rattle us emotionally. For those of you that believe his points are valid, you all are blind. The reason I say this is because you're letting societal and economic fairness off the hook. If most black people made the kind of money the folks at UNC, or State were making, and putting it into our HBCU programs, we'd be able to compete on a contniuous bases also. When people (potential candidates, athletes) see you're budget is at certain level then you're only going to attract certain level people. We talk of management and good leadership, it's there. Difference is you're only going to see a certain level of results. With the budget we have, I bet none of you could do a better job. It's easy for white/black folks to be critical of A&T without adding the social factors. As they say, you are a product or your environment. Well, A&T is just that! Until we have the numbers like certain white schools, we'll never attract the big time coaches, see the major upgrades, or biggest and best players. We'll just have to keep progressing as we've been, and take the bumps that comes with it until the big dollars start to come our way, like the WF, Apps, UNC and State. This won't happen over night. It will, maybe, when the social and economic climate changes. To the brother that initiated this post, you should be ashamed of yourself for falling into the trap of the white man. You should have defended your institution by addressing the unbalanced, and unequal attitudes and support of the institutions. Remember, it's brothers on the field that's drawing that money to those schools. And we know money is at the root of it all.
SUCKER!
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Post by econgrad71 on Oct 31, 2007 16:20:00 GMT -5
"I only apologize for taking you to a place where you can't control your anger."
Freeze...Don't give aahhbigboy, or his comments, a second thought. He obviously seeks attention; let him enjoy his 15 minutes of fame (as such). He'll past.
Dooms... Having A&T on my resume actually got me an interview also...with IBM. I later went to grad school (VCU). I've worked as a Government Budget Analyst, and retired in marketing with a communications company. What I found was when the door of opportunity is cracked, kick it in. Once in, PERFORM! Do your damn job. Now since retirement, I enjoy life, play golf 3 to 4 times a week, and read stupid sh#t on this message board by the likes of aahhbigboy. Man, I'm having a ball!
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Aggie77
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Post by Aggie77 on Oct 31, 2007 19:16:33 GMT -5
This is what I don't understand, "societal and economic fairness off the hook", we are willing to put the blame on some generic buzzwords, than accept and demand better from our leadership or even our peers. If the ones that actually give crap (like many of you that have posted) and think things are great then substandard is our apex.
How many remember the 5 year $100 million Capital Campaign? What year did it start, in case you don’t know I’ll tell you July 1999. I’ll let you do the math. It not called the Five Year Campaign. Go research how much actual cash is in the fund. Bennett announced a five year campaign ($50m) completed it in three years, started another one, go research how much is actual cash. There are people out there that give big bucks to the University. In fact just this past weekend a brother pledge $350k to the Capital Campaign through a combination corporate matching gift, stock appreciation and out of pocket money.
"If most black people made the kind of money the folks at UNC, or State were making . . ." yadda, yadda, yadda, bah, bah, bah. That explains the total dollars given disparity, what about the huge percentage difference in alumni giving? We need to increase the level to at least 50% of all alumni. Here’s another issue that tweaks me the wrong way. I always here about the economic Homecoming is to Greensboro. Where is the marketing campaign to capitalize on that audience that comes to town every single year? At a minimum there should be an information packet for every alum checking in, requesting updated mailing, requesting donations for this or that, schedule of University sponsored events.
My vision of A&T is so different than so many of you that believe, we have been around for a 116 years, so we will be alright (tell that to the alums of Kittrell College), we have Greatest Homecoming on Earth (that’s a strong argument), we got the Greensboro Four, economic unfairness is holding us back, or my personal favorite “it will be alright, they know what they are doing or they would have been hired”. You are the ones that are blinded by the good times, the history, and the talk-speak, the physical improvements, and are forgetting about the future. If we aren’t the caretakers of our Alma Mater, then who is: Stanley Battle?
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Post by truthseeker on Oct 31, 2007 19:20:06 GMT -5
a&t is so academically ridged that kids are flunking out...!!!!... & i was able to graduate...!!!!.... then that makes me one of the proud... the few... that makes me a m#ther f$%king genius... damn all these yrs & i never thought i was that fu#king smart until this thread.... go figure...
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Freeze
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Post by Freeze on Oct 31, 2007 19:26:23 GMT -5
This is what I don't understand, "societal and economic fairness off the hook", we are willing to put the blame on some generic buzzwords, than accept and demand better from our leadership or even our peers. If the ones that actually give crap (like many of you that have posted) and think things are great then substandard is our apex. How many remember the 5 year $100 million Capital Campaign? What year did it start, in case you don’t know I’ll tell you July 1999. I’ll let you do the math. It not called the Five Year Campaign. Go research how much actual cash is in the fund. Bennett announced a five year campaign ($50m) completed it in three years, started another one, go research how much is actual cash. There are people out there that give big bucks to the University. In fact just this past weekend a brother pledge $350k to the Capital Campaign through a combination corporate matching gift, stock appreciation and out of pocket money. "If most black people made the kind of money the folks at UNC, or State were making . . ." yadda, yadda, yadda, bah, bah, bah. That explains the total dollars given disparity, what about the huge percentage difference in alumni giving? We need to increase the level to at least 50% of all alumni. Here’s another issue that tweaks me the wrong way. I always here about the economic Homecoming is to Greensboro. Where is the marketing campaign to capitalize on that audience that comes to town every single year? At a minimum there should be an information packet for every alum checking in, requesting updated mailing, requesting donations for this or that, schedule of University sponsored events. My vision of A&T is so different than so many of you that believe, we have been around for a 116 years, so we will be alright (tell that to the alums of Kittrell College), we have Greatest Homecoming on Earth (that’s a strong argument), we got the Greensboro Four, economic unfairness is holding us back, or my personal favorite “it will be alright, they know what they are doing or they would have been hired”. You are the ones that are blinded by the good times, the history, and the talk-speak, the physical improvements, and are forgetting about the future. If we aren’t the caretakers of our Alma Mater, then who is: Stanley Battle? Man what are you talking about. I challenge anybody who reads this thread to find proof that any poster said "everything is alright" and sit on the laurels of our past. I think most folks on this board will tell you that we have major problems at our institutions. But why would that suggest that we should merge with UNC-G or bring in white administrators? All I'm saying is be VERY careful about jumping to major extremes when trying to rationalize our deficiencies...which is what the author of the post did. Hell yeah we should raise relevant critiques about how our schools do business, but dont suggest that we should shut down and merge with white schools...now that is extremists, defeatist, and ignorant.
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Post by truthseeker on Oct 31, 2007 19:39:54 GMT -5
bottom line... after finishing a&t there is no doubt.... i could... get a degree from any school in the world... none... because i left here ready for the world...
to our fearless leaders in dowdy... make no mistake... a&t is a great university...& there are a lot of eyes on us... watching how YOU manage the direction we will take... will your decisions make us even greater... or will they crumble us to our knees... my vote is for greatness... because.............
GREATNESS IS OUR ONLY DESTINY.........
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Post by DOOMS on Oct 31, 2007 19:47:44 GMT -5
Honestly, I didn't get mad because I have talked cash isht about A&T over the years. I think folks got mad because 1. deep down they know a lot of it is true and 2. the image they had is one of you selling out family secrets to the man. You know we can talk junk about it but don't let an outsider hip to it. Like we weren't just on ESPN for that "brawl" with Central or something.
Hell, the first essay I wrote in English 101 was entitled "A&T: Awful and Terrible." I complained about the dorms and the food and the fact that I had to pay out of state tuition for that bullisht while my high school buddies at UGA were living in climate controlled apartments, eating in a damned on campus food court and had unlimited coed visitation. Meanwhile I'm in a dorm with no phones in the room, no a/c, a got-dam hazardous radiator that we cooked on and naked negroes showering around me with no shower curtain or divider between us and eating "food" that tasted eerily similar to paper with salt.
There wasn't even an elevator in my department's building. We had to beg a first-floor class to switch rooms with us so an older lady in a wheelchair could attend our African lit class. At least five people every summer session passed out trying to sign up for classes in that hot a$$ Corbett. Armed robbers ran through our dorm unencumbered after holding up the bank down the street. There was a neighborhood in the middle of campus and if you didn't watch yourself you might catch a bad one walking through there at the wrong time. The old library was an asbestos hazard. The new one didn't have any books. I went to summer school almost every year. WHY?!?!? There was no a/c almost everywhere on campus. You couldn't even buy a damn book from the bookstore my freshman year. You had to borrow them and return them at the end of the semester and wait in a day-long line to even get them.
But damn! The teachers (most of them) were just great! They really cared. The friends I made were and are incredible. I would not trade the experience for anything, even though I know I could've gone to much "better" schools. And even though sometimes I shake my head at some of the "alumni" that share my alma mater.
But Aggie 77 is on point. We don't give and we don't hold people accountable. Therefore, it won't get better. When we do both we will see some real change.
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Freeze
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Post by Freeze on Oct 31, 2007 20:57:22 GMT -5
Man you suffer from an inability to grasp critical analysis. You (the originator of this post) said we should merge with UNC-G because of all the problems that we have (from a horrible head coach to the lack of parking). That is extremist, defeatist, and ignorant. If you cant see how suggesting we should erase our identity and merge with a cross town white school is extremist then I will digress.
Hell yall can shoot away at A&T and what we dont do well. 90% of it I will probably AGREE with you about. Critique is good and improving upon those defeciencies are even better. All I'm saying is STOP, READ, and THINK about what you have posted. You jump to some SERIOUS extremes bruh and you knew it before you even started the post because you said "I know some of yall are going to be pissed."
If you check this board you will find numerous post that are extremely critical of what we are doing as an institution...especially in football. We've been ragging on what we dont do well on this site wayyyyy before you started posting. All I'm saying is, your language and content was purposefully intended to shock and incite....and as you can see...3 pages later, it worked. Not necessarily because you raised an insightful and rational critique like so many others have done before, but because you jumped to perhaps the most major extreme of them all when it comes to A&T...merger with UNC-G. How you came to that extreme conclusion because we are having the worst downturn in Aggie football history is far beyond me. I enjoy good critical thinking, and you are partly right, this site is full of folks who love to imagine A&T as a blissful rose garden without focusing on the god awful weeds that are choking our institution to death. Well bruh...trust me...I'm a pruner, and I believe in cleaning out the trash. But destroying the garden and going to what you THINK are greener pastures is something that you will never get me to cosign. All I'm saying is your critique is full of flaws and misconceptions on what you think white folks do right in higher education without understanding that they do a ton of things wrong as well.
I dont think you are a fool, but I think your post was foolish for what it crudely and ultimately suggested.
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Freeze
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Post by Freeze on Oct 31, 2007 20:59:43 GMT -5
By the way...I'm still waiting for someone to show where someone in this thread said there is NOTHING wrong at A&T and everything is going along just fine.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Oct 31, 2007 21:23:30 GMT -5
This thread makes my head hurt.
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Aggie77
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Post by Aggie77 on Oct 31, 2007 22:28:06 GMT -5
By the way...I'm still waiting for someone to show where someone in this thread said there is NOTHING wrong at A&T and everything is going along just fine. I’m not getting the repeated reference, but since it appears directed to me by being initially attached to my post? Please explain. My vision of A&T is so different than so many of you that believe, we have been around for a 116 years, so we will be alright (tell that to the alums of Kittrell College), we have Greatest Homecoming on Earth (that’s a strong argument), we got the Greensboro Four, economic unfairness is holding us back, or my personal favorite “it will be alright, they know what they are doing or they would have been hired”. You are the ones that are blinded by the good times, the history, and the talk-speak, the physical improvements, and are forgetting about the future. If we aren’t the caretakers of our Alma Mater, then who is: Stanley Battle? If it is in reference to the above text nothing there suggests any poster said “everything is alright”, my point is many, many posters and a greater number of alumni think because of our history, our homecoming popularity, or the other things mentioned, that the University will be alright, I guess just because it always has. I’m obviously of the opinion more alums need to be involved financially and vocally and that we can be greater than we are. Now to continue the UNC-G can of worms. I’m always paranoid about that issue. Because in my mind, if it is legislated, what are we gonna do boycott, march in the street, riot? We don’t have the voting power, legislative muscle, nor the financial wherewithal to control that decision. I always hear the federal land grant argument, but that is just the stroke of a pen. A&T is a member of UNC System anything can happen. There is significant duplication of programs throughout the system.
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