aggie2039
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Post by aggie2039 on Jul 8, 2021 10:10:49 GMT -5
August is probably the last thing on my mind. The script for August is pretty much set, and no amount of planning or suggestions at this point is doing anything to change it. Long term is exactly what I'm getting at - 1 to 10 years out and beyond. It definitely does depend on teachers and administration - that's where I'm hoping our staff could initiate something - maybe reaching out and offering help. I don't think parents are as big a factor as as some make them out to be. The reason is the kids butts are already in the seats at the middle school level - numbers are usually fine there. Once the kids are enrolled, it's up to the director to work with them and motivate them to stay. Band may not be cool in NC high schools. It's also true that a lot of the NC high school programs aren't good. That just might have a lot to do with it. I wouldn't have wanted to play for any of the other NC college bands, so I can see where they could be coming from. Ceasar spent a couple of years at JCSU and turned them from the dirty thirty into a legit Hodge style band. He did the same at WSSU, and both fell apart immediately after he left. Some director from Howard - don't know his name - remade Bowie St the same way. Bonds did it at Del State. Thomas did it at Hampton. Reid did it at NCCU. Millsap did it at Dudley. Hoover did it at Shaw Jr High. None of those turnarounds had anything to do with parents, scholarships, or resources. It was ALL the directors, and the administration that got them there. A&T may not be graduating band directors fast enough to make a big dent in any of the local school systems. But I'm just wondering is there more we could do, even if we was just providing part time assistants or something. Or strategically placing the few graduates we do have when opportunities open up. Near term, A&T's going to be fine. We've had about 150 horns since forever, and other than wanting more from the bones (which CAN be done immediately) I'm not looking for or expecting big changes. But looking at some of the horrible middle / high school programs out there, and seeing first hand the difference a good staff can make, and how many more potential recruits that could create, I just wish we could expand our influence. I hear what you are saying but, I think the start should begin on A&T's campus. We have the largest HBCU enrollment and I am willing to bet that if you were to poll the undergraduate student body did they play in the band in high school; I believe at least 300+ students would say "Yes." So now, that opens another can of worms, why aren't they interested in marching in the band at the school they currently attend. As much as we try and divert from it but, it will always come back around to resources. If we don't have resources to offer then unfortunately, we are in a round-robin discussion. It will always come back to that. I look at schools whose enrollment isn't even half as ours and their bands are twice our size: Talladega College: 1,230 enrollment Bethune Cookman: 2,779 enrollment We sit at roughly 12K students of that at least 9K are undergraduate students. Out of those 9K students, I'm sure 3% play an instrument of some kind. So, how do the band directors attract that 3% is the magical question. And without resources, I cannot give you a practical answer. There is nothing else to do there 🤷🏾‍♂️, I was born there so I know. It’s probably worse than ECSU. We must quit comparing the east coast to the Deep South…what east coast HBCU has a SWAC size band? All the east coast HBCUs are larger than Dega
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Post by ohsixrain on Jul 8, 2021 10:56:36 GMT -5
I hear what you are saying but, I think the start should begin on A&T's campus. We have the largest HBCU enrollment and I am willing to bet that if you were to poll the undergraduate student body did they play in the band in high school; I believe at least 300+ students would say "Yes." So now, that opens another can of worms, why aren't they interested in marching in the band at the school they currently attend. As much as we try and divert from it but, it will always come back around to resources. If we don't have resources to offer then unfortunately, we are in a round-robin discussion. It will always come back to that. I look at schools whose enrollment isn't even half as ours and their bands are twice our size: Talladega College: 1,230 enrollment Bethune Cookman: 2,779 enrollment We sit at roughly 12K students of that at least 9K are undergraduate students. Out of those 9K students, I'm sure 3% play an instrument of some kind. So, how do the band directors attract that 3% is the magical question. And without resources, I cannot give you a practical answer. There is nothing else to do there 🤷🏾‍♂️, I was born there so I know. It’s probably worse than ECSU. We must quit comparing the east coast to the Deep South…what east coast HBCU has a SWAC size band? All the east coast HBCUs are larger than Dega I don't disagree with you...I am pointing out the idea that it's resources. To say that kids are interested in marching band isn't totally true either. To say that 280 kids at a school of 1,200 joins the band because it's in the deep south isn't good enough. I submit to you that Talladega is a school that has resources to give to these students to march in the band. I mean, they don't even have a football team for Pete's sake...come on. It's all about resources, no need to be in denial.
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919aggie
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Post by 919aggie on Jul 8, 2021 11:12:58 GMT -5
There is nothing else to do there 🤷🏾‍♂️, I was born there so I know. It’s probably worse than ECSU. We must quit comparing the east coast to the Deep South…what east coast HBCU has a SWAC size band? All the east coast HBCUs are larger than Dega I don't disagree with you...I am pointing out the idea that it's resources. To say that kids are interested in marching band isn't totally true either. To say that 280 kids at a school of 1,200 joins the band because it's in the deep south isn't good enough. I submit to you that Talladega is a school that has resources to give to these students to march in the band. I mean, they don't even have a football team for Pete's sake...come on. It's all about resources, no need to be in denial. It's just like Bethune...I've never seen them go under 300 students. Ppl call them boring and everything else under the sun but they still choose to go. One of their members stated that they are at the top of the food chain when it come's to HBCU band scholarships. Don't forget about this...
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Post by marchingband1969 on Jul 8, 2021 11:14:59 GMT -5
Let me start by saying A&T has been very successful (and a little lucky) over the years to pick Band Directors that could continue the marching band legacy created by Walter F. Carlson in the 1940s through 1960s. They have had the drive and talent to keep the A&T Marching Band from being an embarrassment to the alumni and students. If you doubt what I'm saying, look at some of the crap marching bands NCCU and Howard have had over the past 10 or 20 years. As I have to keep reminding my alumni friends, A&T is a STEM university not a fine arts university! So our funding and resources go to STEM programs first. Over the decades our head band directors have had to find ways to recruit and entice those non fine arts students to join the band. And once they are in the band, they have to convince them to practice 3 to 4 hours every evening just to entertain fans on Saturday. And our directors have done a fantastic job in doing that without a large funding base and only a handful of music majors. Before we branch out and try to "fix" the junior and senior high school band programs, we need to first start at home... and fix our program. We need to provide our band a first rate band facility. Folks, our band program has been operating out of an auto parts store and rundown warehouse for 15 or 20 years! It's hard to recruit talented musicians when all you have to show them is a gravel parking lot and a hot warehouse! Now I know there are "plans" for a new band facility but it ain't here now! And the one they are planning to build "someday" is already 30 years late! As supporters of the athletic programs, folks on Blue Death Valley understand how important facilities are in recruiting talented athletes. Well, the BGMM's facilities are getto quality and have been for decades! Next, we need more scholarships. I'm not talking about full rides, just $500 to $1000 for every band student. That would go a long way to encourage them to join and stay in the band. Today we have about 130 band students... at $500 per students that would be an additional $65,000 per semester! And finally, we need a decent practice field with lights! For the past decade the band has practiced in the parking lot behind the stadium. A muddy, gravel pit, with poor lighting! It's a wonder the band doesn't have more twisted ankles practicing on that field. A&T has been very lucky to have great marching bands in spite of our lack of facilities, scholarships and resources. If we don't fix these issues, one day our luck may run out. That will be a sad day for our alumni, students and fans. So all the band alums combined can’t raise that much annually? That $65,000 doesn't sound like a lot but unfortunately very few marching band alums actually give anything back to the BGMM. Oh a bunch of them show up at Homecoming to march in the parade but I'd bet fewer that 5% of the ones that march donate anything to the band. And unfortunately the band doesn't have a fully staffed resource like the AAF to organize and solicit funds. Let's face it, raising serious money in today's environment takes a serious plan and dedicated resources to carry out those plans. The BGMM doesn't have either.
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aggie2039
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Post by aggie2039 on Jul 8, 2021 11:17:58 GMT -5
I don't disagree with you...I am pointing out the idea that it's resources. To say that kids are interested in marching band isn't totally true either. To say that 280 kids at a school of 1,200 joins the band because it's in the deep south isn't good enough. I submit to you that Talladega is a school that has resources to give to these students to march in the band. I mean, they don't even have a football team for Pete's sake...come on. It's all about resources, no need to be in denial. It's just like Bethune...I've never seen them go under 300 students. Ppl call them boring and everything else under the sun but they still choose to go. One of their members stated that they are at the top of the food chain when it come's to HBCU band scholarships. Don't forget about this... View AttachmentBruh, that document holds no more value than the paper it is printed on. It says sc state invest $1.1M in band…I know that is wrong. Based off that I can’t believe anything else that is written.
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Post by ohsixrain on Jul 8, 2021 11:36:10 GMT -5
It's just like Bethune...I've never seen them go under 300 students. Ppl call them boring and everything else under the sun but they still choose to go. One of their members stated that they are at the top of the food chain when it come's to HBCU band scholarships. Don't forget about this... View AttachmentBruh, that document holds no more value than the paper it is printed on. It says sc state invest $1.1M in band…I know that is wrong. Based off that I can’t believe anything else that is written. You are right...SC State ran into serious budget constraints and the band's funding was seriously cut in the mid 2010's. However, that was the truth at the beginning of the decade. Also, it's misleading by saying that they had/have a scholarship budget that large, I don't believe that to be the case either. It makes sense that those are annual band budgets for each institution listed. But, in the end, it will still come down to resources. I know for a fact, BCU is able to offer full ride schollys to their members. That was came from the horses mouth Donovan Wells, Director of Bands at BCU.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2021 6:45:34 GMT -5
So all the band alums combined can’t raise that much annually? That $65,000 doesn't sound like a lot but unfortunately very few marching band alums actually give anything back to the BGMM. Oh a bunch of them show up at Homecoming to march in the parade but I'd bet fewer that 5% of the ones that march donate anything to the band. And unfortunately the band doesn't have a fully staffed resource like the AAF to organize and solicit funds. Let's face it, raising serious money in today's environment takes a serious plan and dedicated resources to carry out those plans. The BGMM doesn't have either. Sheesh! Call me crazy but Alumni should probably pay - if they don’t already - to March in the Alumni Band. 🤷🏿‍♂️
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2021 6:46:40 GMT -5
I don't disagree with you...I am pointing out the idea that it's resources. To say that kids are interested in marching band isn't totally true either. To say that 280 kids at a school of 1,200 joins the band because it's in the deep south isn't good enough. I submit to you that Talladega is a school that has resources to give to these students to march in the band. I mean, they don't even have a football team for Pete's sake...come on. It's all about resources, no need to be in denial. It's just like Bethune...I've never seen them go under 300 students. Ppl call them boring and everything else under the sun but they still choose to go. One of their members stated that they are at the top of the food chain when it come's to HBCU band scholarships. Don't forget about this... View AttachmentTalladega College poached B&GMM members? Wow.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2021 6:49:24 GMT -5
August is probably the last thing on my mind. The script for August is pretty much set, and no amount of planning or suggestions at this point is doing anything to change it. Long term is exactly what I'm getting at - 1 to 10 years out and beyond. It definitely does depend on teachers and administration - that's where I'm hoping our staff could initiate something - maybe reaching out and offering help. I don't think parents are as big a factor as as some make them out to be. The reason is the kids butts are already in the seats at the middle school level - numbers are usually fine there. Once the kids are enrolled, it's up to the director to work with them and motivate them to stay. Band may not be cool in NC high schools. It's also true that a lot of the NC high school programs aren't good. That just might have a lot to do with it. I wouldn't have wanted to play for any of the other NC college bands, so I can see where they could be coming from. Ceasar spent a couple of years at JCSU and turned them from the dirty thirty into a legit Hodge style band. He did the same at WSSU, and both fell apart immediately after he left. Some director from Howard - don't know his name - remade Bowie St the same way. Bonds did it at Del State. Thomas did it at Hampton. Reid did it at NCCU. Millsap did it at Dudley. Hoover did it at Shaw Jr High. None of those turnarounds had anything to do with parents, scholarships, or resources. It was ALL the directors, and the administration that got them there. A&T may not be graduating band directors fast enough to make a big dent in any of the local school systems. But I'm just wondering is there more we could do, even if we was just providing part time assistants or something. Or strategically placing the few graduates we do have when opportunities open up. Near term, A&T's going to be fine. We've had about 150 horns since forever, and other than wanting more from the bones (which CAN be done immediately) I'm not looking for or expecting big changes. But looking at some of the horrible middle / high school programs out there, and seeing first hand the difference a good staff can make, and how many more potential recruits that could create, I just wish we could expand our influence. I hear what you are saying but, I think the start should begin on A&T's campus. We have the largest HBCU enrollment and I am willing to bet that if you were to poll the undergraduate student body did they play in the band in high school; I believe at least 300+ students would say "Yes." So now, that opens another can of worms, why aren't they interested in marching in the band at the school they currently attend. As much as we try and divert from it but, it will always come back around to resources. If we don't have resources to offer then unfortunately, we are in a round-robin discussion. It will always come back to that. I look at schools whose enrollment isn't even half as ours and their bands are twice our size: Talladega College: 1,230 enrollment Bethune Cookman: 2,779 enrollment We sit at roughly 12K students of that at least 9K are undergraduate students. Out of those 9K students, I'm sure 3% play an instrument of some kind. So, how do the band directors attract that 3% is the magical question. And without resources, I cannot give you a practical answer. I was one of those kids that didn’t want to March while on campus. I enjoyed the freedom a bit too much to dedicate time to playing my baritone horn. However, I would’ve sucked it up and marched if I had my out of state tuition paid for via a band scholarship.
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Post by DOOMS on Jul 9, 2021 7:14:33 GMT -5
Question:
If we had a dedicated state of the art band room/practice area attached to a new stadium along with either a partial scholarship or a switch to in-state tuition, do you think you’d have marched?
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aggie2039
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Post by aggie2039 on Jul 9, 2021 7:24:49 GMT -5
Why do we need a big band? No one on the east coast has a large band and we know the big south schools don’t have one either.
Please explain the logic of having a large band and no one to battle against🤷🏾‍♂️
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Post by DOOMS on Jul 9, 2021 7:31:19 GMT -5
As an HBCU, the largest HBCU for that matter, it probably doesn't need explanation. Not to mention we still will play several HBCUs every year.
The purpose of the band at this juncture is not so much to battle against other conference bands, it's to provide support to the team, entertain alumni and students, battle against bands in battles of the bands, and continue to spread our name far and wide.
If we had a smaller or heaven forbid a poorly performing band, it wouldn't reflect well on us.
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aggie2039
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Post by aggie2039 on Jul 9, 2021 7:36:19 GMT -5
As an HBCU, the largest HBCU for that matter, it probably doesn't need explanation. Not to mention we still will play several HBCUs every year. The purpose of the band at this juncture is not so much to battle against other conference bands, it's to provide support to the team, entertain alumni and students, battle against bands in battles of the bands, and continue to spread our name far and wide. If we had a smaller or heaven forbid a poorly performing band, it wouldn't reflect well on us. We are a HBCU that plays other HBCUs with small bands, again…what east coast HBCU has a large band? Norfolk and A&T have similar size bands and they brought they noise. Why carry a 225 piece band to perform in one battle of the band competition? Doesn’t add up Additionally, who says are alumni aren’t entertained now by our band…size isn’t going to entertain us. If they are a large band and still play the same boring tunes it will still be a large unenthusiastic boring band that is a resource drain. Wasted money We are the largest HBCU that doesn’t have best football stadium or basketball coliseum or weight room. I would rather invest in those facilities than spend $25M in the band.
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Post by DOOMS on Jul 9, 2021 7:43:07 GMT -5
Admittedly I don't even know the difference between a "large" and a "small" band. Other than figuring the largest hbcu should have at least a fairly large band (without even knowing what size that actually is lol) I'll have to step back due to my complete ignorance on the point.
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aggie2039
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Post by aggie2039 on Jul 9, 2021 7:45:12 GMT -5
Admittedly I don't even know the difference between a "large" and a "small" band. Other than figuring the largest hbcu should have at least a fairly large band (without even knowing what size that actually is lol) I'll have to step back due to my complete ignorance on the point. You and I both, I do believe in providing them more funding however full out of state tuition scholarship is a lot to ask.
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