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Post by Bornthrilla on May 13, 2008 21:20:06 GMT -5
I agree with ahhbigboy. Eaves has enough resources to be successful.
His shortcomings can not be blamed on money. Money was not the reason he was unable to pick a consistent rotation this year or why his teams always seem to play at a break-neck pace and commit a huge amount of turnovers.
As far recruiting, he should be able to get 2 or 3 decent players just off the strength of the dawg pound youtube video.
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Post by Aggie Monster on May 13, 2008 21:22:54 GMT -5
Jazz please stop it with the drama. I'm not trying to make the kid look bad. I just question why everyone but us passed on him, especially after his showing in the state playoffs. I guess I'll just figure the other 600 schools in D-I and D-II didn't do their homework and we got lucky. AM perhaps you have the best explanation. hey, decks. maybe its his grades... Div I grades are all the same. No difference between us and anyone else. If it was grades he would be going DIV2
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Post by aggiejazz on May 14, 2008 7:40:25 GMT -5
hey, decks. maybe its his grades... Div I grades are all the same. No difference between us and anyone else. If it was grades he would be going DIV2 Sadly, it is a little more complicated than that. Even if a recruit qualifies by NCAA academic standards those standards are not A&T's standards or UNC University system standards believe it or not. UNC University system requires incoming freshmen to have taken certain courses and a certain number of units in those areas also A&T have different standards for in-state and out-of-state. Not all states are the same when it comes to high school requirements for college entry. If you don't think this is a not problem at A&T in getting recruits in, think again. I will say again people want a lot for only a little. You may not be happy with the men's BB program but guess what, you are stuck and the university only has change in their pockets. The smart People screamed and shouted -just like now with Eaves- about how Hayes and Small are not good enough coaches. Somehow the administration along with smart alumni urging found money they wouldn't give to Hayes or Small and gave it to the present football coaching staff. In three years you may get 2 or 3 wins for your trouble. Keep this up and you may be looking at the same thing with basketball. Instead of fighting for 3rd place and building to challenge for first the Aggies will again be fighting to stay out of the cellar with the people who know better than Eaves calling the shots.
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DECKS
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Post by DECKS on May 14, 2008 7:45:07 GMT -5
maybe if you all give more money back we can get more talent and build a new gym. You might want to be a little more specific because a lot of the folks on this board are some of the best givers to Aggie athletics.
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Post by Aggie Monster on May 14, 2008 7:47:45 GMT -5
Am I missing something? I dont see where Eaves has been wronged here in any way. He's been allowed to build the program his way. He's not a new coach anymore so all the old excuses should not be allowed. He knows what he has to work with so he needs to step it up. if he is from the Kentucky area then he already using what he's got to get what he wants. That's a step forward right there.
Yeah, money is short, so what. If you talk to any coach in the nation they will all say they could use some more recruiting dollars. In my opinion dollars for recruiting is not even an issue in the MEAC or any other conference. The richest team aint the best and the poorest team aint last. Same applies to football.
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Post by aahhbigboy on May 14, 2008 7:59:52 GMT -5
Am I missing something? I dont see where Eaves has been wronged here in any way. He's been allowed to build the program his way. He's not a new coach anymore so all the old excuses should not be allowed. He knows what he has to work with so he needs to step it up. if he is from the Kentucky area then he already using what he's got to get what he wants. That's a step forward right there. Yeah, money is short, so what. If you talk to any coach in the nation they will all say they could use some more recruiting dollars. In my opinion dollars for recruiting is not even an issue in the MEAC or any other conference. The richest team aint the best and the poorest team aint last. Same applies to football. Man, this couldn't be said any better. The people making the excuses is really what keep anything (in any business) from getting done. The bottom line is this. It doesn't take a whole lot to win in the MEAC. One or two decent-good recruits and a competent coach and you can find yourself in the NCAA tourney. Just ask Fang. My point is this, we may have a decent recruit, but I don't think anyone can say with any confidence that it looks like we can win a championship in the near future. All you have to do is go to ONE game. We have a bad system, a whole bunch of mediocre players, and a coach that yells the whole game. His performance during the season and now in the off season has been consistently bad-mediocre. This can't be argued.
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DECKS
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Post by DECKS on May 14, 2008 8:01:23 GMT -5
Aggie Monster you are correct again. Norfolk State has a smaller athletic budget than us, yet they consistenly compete for the All-Sports trophy on the men and womens side. Personally I think Eaves has done a pretty decent job of recruiting since he's been at A&T.
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Post by Aggie Monster on May 14, 2008 8:35:24 GMT -5
I also think he's come along slowly and is now doing a decent job recruiting.
On that note, if Jarad Grady(signed by Deleware State about 2 weeks ago, 6'3" guard) ever lights us up I'm going to be pissed. He was interested in coming to A&T and no one ever got with him. Myself and krazykev threw his name out there several times. he was right in our backyard in Durham. not even a half tank of gas away.
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Post by aahhbigboy on May 14, 2008 8:58:01 GMT -5
I also think he's come along slowly and is now doing a decent job recruiting. On that note, if Jarad Grady(signed by Deleware State about 2 weeks ago, 6'3" guard) ever lights us up I'm going to be pissed. He was interested in coming to A&T and no one ever got with him. Myself and krazykev threw his name out there several times. he was right in our backyard in Durham. not even a half tank of gas away. You know, I also think we have decent players. My criticism is that they don't work well in our system. I mean really, is Coleman serving us well by standing near the top of the key handing the ball off to a small guard? Yeah he's a REALLY good young player, but look how we use him. How will these other guys be used and will it net better results than what we have seen. For instance, take Del. St. They will never have a dominant big man. Why? Because Jack doesn't recruit them. His system is set up to get good medium range shots so he finds guards that can flourish in his system. I've never seen Grady play, but I bet he's a pretty good shooter. So my point is this. Do we have decent players? Absolutely! Can (or have they ever) flourish in our system? Not Really (with the exception of 1 or 2). So, is the recruiting good if that is the case?
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Post by Aggie Monster on May 14, 2008 10:17:45 GMT -5
Actually Grady worked very real hard to improve his jumper. That was his weak point. He was more of a slashing "one leg" jumping type of guard, if that makes sense(ala Jalen Rose). I liked him because he was big for a guard, gave little guards hell on both sides of the ball, and could handle the rock. He was also already "grown man" size and not one of these toothpicks coming out of high school these days.
Oh well, Thats a touchy spot for me cause Jared Grady might as well be family so I cant wish him bad luck against A&T, but I will be pissed if he dominates us.
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oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on May 14, 2008 12:52:30 GMT -5
until our athletic budget is "at least" on par with 3 quarters of the meac, you can't expect a&t to attract top talent. we give the man peanuts to recruit with and a corbett center that still needs more renovations, yet we expect him to sign top recruits? why do you think he keeps recruiting in his home state of kentucky? with the budget we have, it takes "extraordinary" coaches like bill hayes and patricia bibbs to win championships at a&t and it shouldn't be that way. we always have to have coaches that can do more with less. unfortunately those kind of coaches are hard to find and even harder to keep. give eaves hampton's budget and convocation center, and he'll deliver top talent and championship contenders… I copied and pasted this from a response I had for another person with your same kind of mentality. "The picture you've painted has made me ill. Here's a couple of questions and a comment to follow. What have we caught? What do you need all that money for? Where is MSU's and CSU's budget? They were in the tourney final. What is Bibbs' budget? Did she need that money to get ballers? This type of reasoning makes me sick. Did Memphis' budget need to be on par with UNC's, Florida's, UK's, Kansas' to make it to the national championship? So many of you set the bar so low because of a darn budget. Give me a break. I don't know this, but was Capel's budget larger than everyone else's and is that why he won? How about Corbett? How about Thomas' for that matter? You guys sound like the project kid that swears he can't make it because he wasn't born with a silver spoon. Get past that self-pity mentality and raise the bar. " bigboy, your arguments are extremely naïve. unless you have "extraordinary" coaches (which are rare), the success of division 1 athletics is largely dictated by facilities, exposure, and financial resources. coach nickelberry at hampton is not an "extraordinary" coach but he has excellent facilities, exposure (ncaa tourney win), and financial resources, so he's successful. "extraordinary" coaches can win with less. fang and bozeman are both "extraordinary" coaches. i don't know what morgan's budget is but how long do you think bozeman will be in baltimore? and i don't know what coppin's budget is either, but i would suggest that you check to see how many guaranteed "money" games coppin played. considering they don't have a football team, those games provided a tremendous boost to their budget. and you can't use bibbs as an example of your argument because she is not a typical coach, she's "extraordinary" and can win with less. why do you think the coaches before her were so unsuccessful? do you think it’s a coincidence that before bibbs and eaves arrived, both our men and women basketball teams were flat out horrible? regarding the memphis tigers, again you're talking about an "extraordinary" coach in john calipari. where was memphis basketball before calipari arrived? where was umass basketball before and after calipari arrived? i rest my case. so all of your arguments are bogus. its easy to pick out an extraordinary coach's school and argue why they out perform schools with larger budgets. obviously, you know very little about college athletics relative to financial resources. in an effort to improve its football team, duke university just recently "doubled" their budget from $7.5 million to $15 million. i don't know, maybe you're smarter than duke's administrators, but here's what they had to say about improving their football program; "The whole point is we've been operating on what was increasingly an antiquated funding model," Brodhead said. "This (increase) is just an acknowledgement of the fact that athletics requires a different level of investment." and that's exactly what's wrong with a&t's athletics, and not just football. our budget is extremely "antiquated"! we're trying to run a division 1 program on a division 2 budget! the meac and swac are probably the two poorest division 1 conferences in america. if our budget ranks in the lower 25% of the meac, guess where we rank amongst all division 1 programs? care to guess? i don't, because its down right embarrassing. we're one of the largest hbcu's in all of america and the best we can do with our budget is rank amongst the lower 25% of the meac? delaware state is one of the smaller hbcu's and they have high school like athletic facilities. yet they win the meac football championship, they owned the meac in basketball the last 3 out 4 years, and all of their olympics sports teams are very competitive. you think that's luck or maybe a coincidence? i suppose their athletic budget had nothing to do with their success (even though they have the largest budget in the meac). if athletes had to choose between dsu and a&t, i'd bet most of them would choose a&t. but dsu's budget allows them to recruit from a larger pool of athletes than us, plain and simple. there are numerous aau exposure tournaments around the country where college coaches can attend and observe top potential prospects. but it costs money to travel to these events, not to mention costs to follow up on recruits from other parts of the country. our skimpie budget only allows limited recruiting because it costs money to travel, eat, and stay in hotels. take a look at our basketball roster, our entire team is "virtually" from north carolina, south carolina, virginia, maryland, and kentucky. notice any trends? that gives you an idea of where our recruiting is concentrated, it has low budget written all over it. don't you think there's plenty of talent in new york city, philadelphia, memphis, and many other high school hot beds for talent? and you want to know what we need "all that money" for? as I mentioned already, the success of division 1 athletics is largely dictated by facilities, exposure, and financial resources. how much do you think it would cost to replace those worn out hard azz upper level bleachers in corbett? you think that might help recruiting? and let's not even discuss building a new arena. what about coaches' salaries? you think we could hire better head and assistant coaches if we paid more? what about travel and hotel stay? you think its cheap? what about recruiting? you think there's no costs associated with recruiting? like i said in my first statement, you're extremely naïve if you think an athletic budget doesn't directly impact the success of a division 1 athletic program. thank God you're not our athletic director!
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oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on May 14, 2008 12:56:54 GMT -5
hey, decks. maybe its his grades... Div I grades are all the same. No difference between us and anyone else. If it was grades he would be going DIV2 i'm not saying his grades would deem him ineligible. i'm saying some schools shy away from prospects who have borderline grades or has yet to meet all academic requirements...
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DECKS
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Post by DECKS on May 14, 2008 13:35:10 GMT -5
MEAC 2007 budgets based on expenses. ope.ed.gov/athletics/InstList.asp1. DSU $1,800,000 2. Coppin $830,000 3. Hampton $830,000 4.BCU $772,000 5. SCSU $743,000 6. MSU $712,00 7. A&T $695,000 8. NSU $671,000 9. Howard $661,000 10. FAMU $638,000 11.WSSU $547,000 12. UMES $530,000
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Post by aahhbigboy on May 14, 2008 13:48:09 GMT -5
I copied and pasted this from a response I had for another person with your same kind of mentality. "The picture you've painted has made me ill. Here's a couple of questions and a comment to follow. What have we caught? What do you need all that money for? Where is MSU's and CSU's budget? They were in the tourney final. What is Bibbs' budget? Did she need that money to get ballers? This type of reasoning makes me sick. Did Memphis' budget need to be on par with UNC's, Florida's, UK's, Kansas' to make it to the national championship? So many of you set the bar so low because of a darn budget. Give me a break. I don't know this, but was Capel's budget larger than everyone else's and is that why he won? How about Corbett? How about Thomas' for that matter? You guys sound like the project kid that swears he can't make it because he wasn't born with a silver spoon. Get past that self-pity mentality and raise the bar. " bigboy, your arguments are extremely naïve. unless you have "extraordinary" coaches (which are rare), the success of division 1 athletics is largely dictated by facilities, exposure, and financial resources. coach nickelberry at hampton is not an "extraordinary" coach but he has excellent facilities, exposure (ncaa tourney win), and financial resources, so he's successful. "extraordinary" coaches can win with less. fang and bozeman are both "extraordinary" coaches. i don't know what morgan's budget is but how long do you think bozeman will be in baltimore? and i don't know what coppin's budget is either, but i would suggest that you check to see how many guaranteed "money" games coppin played. considering they don't have a football team, those games provided a tremendous boost to their budget. and you can't use bibbs as an example of your argument because she is not a typical coach, she's "extraordinary" and can win with less. why do you think the coaches before her were so unsuccessful? do you think it’s a coincidence that before bibbs and eaves arrived, both our men and women basketball teams were flat out horrible? regarding the memphis tigers, again you're talking about an "extraordinary" coach in john calipari. where was memphis basketball before calipari arrived? where was umass basketball before and after calipari arrived? i rest my case. so all of your arguments are bogus. its easy to pick out an extraordinary coach's school and argue why they out perform schools with larger budgets. obviously, you know very little about college athletics relative to financial resources. in an effort to improve its football team, duke university just recently "doubled" their budget from $7.5 million to $15 million. i don't know, maybe you're smarter than duke's administrators, but here's what they had to say about improving their football program; "The whole point is we've been operating on what was increasingly an antiquated funding model," Brodhead said. "This (increase) is just an acknowledgement of the fact that athletics requires a different level of investment." and that's exactly what's wrong with a&t's athletics, and not just football. our budget is extremely "antiquated"! we're trying to run a division 1 program on a division 2 budget! the meac and swac are probably the two poorest division 1 conferences in america. if our budget ranks in the lower 25% of the meac, guess where we rank amongst all division 1 programs? care to guess? i don't, because its down right embarrassing. we're one of the largest hbcu's in all of america and the best we can do with our budget is rank amongst the lower 25% of the meac? delaware state is one of the smaller hbcu's and they have high school like athletic facilities. yet they win the meac football championship, they owned the meac in basketball the last 3 out 4 years, and all of their olympics sports teams are very competitive. you think that's luck or maybe a coincidence? i suppose their athletic budget had nothing to do with their success (even though they have the largest budget in the meac). if athletes had to choose between dsu and a&t, i'd bet most of them would choose a&t. but dsu's budget allows them to recruit from a larger pool of athletes than us, plain and simple. there are numerous aau exposure tournaments around the country where college coaches can attend and observe top potential prospects. but it costs money to travel to these events, not to mention costs to follow up on recruits from other parts of the country. our skimpie budget only allows limited recruiting because it costs money to travel, eat, and stay in hotels. take a look at our basketball roster, our entire team is "virtually" from north carolina, south carolina, virginia, maryland, and kentucky. notice any trends? that gives you an idea of where our recruiting is concentrated, it has low budget written all over it. don't you think there's plenty of talent in new york city, philadelphia, memphis, and many other high school hot beds for talent? and you want to know what we need "all that money" for? as I mentioned already, the success of division 1 athletics is largely dictated by facilities, exposure, and financial resources. how much do you think it would cost to replace those worn out hard azz upper level bleachers in corbett? you think that might help recruiting? and let's not even discuss building a new arena. what about coaches' salaries? you think we could hire better head and assistant coaches if we paid more? what about travel and hotel stay? you think its cheap? what about recruiting? you think there's no costs associated with recruiting? like i said in my first statement, you're extremely naïve if you think an athletic budget doesn't directly impact the success of a division 1 athletic program. thank God you're not our athletic director! You know, there's a lot of people around there that need to thank God I'm not the AD, because anyone coming at me with your mentality would be the first to go. Anyone that looks at a situation and says "I can't" has to go. But to be totally honest, at some point there is a direct correlation between money and recruiting and I recognize that. But in the super weak MEAC, it doesn't take a mountain of money to win. It never has in the MEAC. And you know what, we don't need an extraordinary coach (in basketball). We need a competent coach. Eaves brings in players that don't even fit his system. There is an enormous wealth of talent between Atlanta, NC, SC, and VA. The current budget supports that and I don't want to hear anything else. As far as I'm concerned, giving this coaching staff more money just means more money wasted. WE CAN WIN WITH WHAT WE HAVE NOW. We've had idiots running the AD's office for quite some time and they've been making critical mistakes for quite some time. I mean, Coach Jack was never interviewed and he was right down the street at Central! Your post is waaayyy too long to respond to everything but to sum it up, it is one big excuse. And you know what excuses are like.....
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bluehaze
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Post by bluehaze on May 14, 2008 14:54:31 GMT -5
MEAC 2007 budgets based on expenses. ope.ed.gov/athletics/InstList.asp1. DSU $1,800,000 2. Coppin $830,000 3. Hampton $830,000 4.BCU $772,000 5. SCSU $743,000 6. MSU $712,00 7. A&T $695,000 8. NSU $671,000 9. Howard $661,000 10. FAMU $638,000 11.WSSU $547,000 12. UMES $530,000 STANDINGS Morgan State Hampton Norfolk State Delaware State N.C. A&T Florida A&M Coppin State South Carolina State Bethune-Cookman Howard Maryland E. Shore UMES spent the least and came out last. DSU was in a rebuilding year and still finished top 4 and Coppin won the tournament. Hampton spent 3rd and came up 2nd. Looks like there's a corelation to the money spent to me.
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