oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Mar 20, 2015 12:02:04 GMT -5
i hear what you're saying, but i disagree. i’m around high school players almost every day and i can tell you for a “fact” that the college they choose to play at is often times judged by their peers as “status symbols”, just like the guy down the street who drives a benz only as a “status symbol”. i’ve had basketball players who i have coached in high school who got numerous offers from d2 schools, but they turned down all of those offers and held out for a d1 school just because they wanted the “status symbol” that says you’re good enough to play at the d1 level. it may sound simple minded to those who do not interact with high school athletes very often, but i’m tellin’ ya, kids look at things like that. now, does that mean a&t will lose out on recruits because we are no longer a part of the fcs playoffs? no, not necessarily. but there is “concrete evidence” that the swac “declined” in football almost immediately after they pulled out of the fcs playoffs. most of you old heads know that the swac use to completely “dominate” the meac in football prior to the swac pulling out of the playoffs and the word “dominate” is probably an understatement. the meac couldn’t touch the swac in football back in the day! but look at the swac now? ever since they pulled out of the playoffs in the late 90’s, the meac has pretty much had its way against swac teams in “head to head” competition. right now, the meac leads the meac/swac challenge 8 wins to the swac’s 2 wins. and most of the meac’s wins were “blowouts”, including our aggies win over alabama a&m 47-13 on national tv last season . even regular season matchups between the meac and the swac favors the meac. i mean, this would’ve been “unheard of” back in the day before the swac pulled out of the playoffs. did swac football decline? or did meac football improve? or could it be both? my “personal theory” is that both happened. i think the reason it happened is twofold. 1 – the meac had a higher bar, so our coaches strived to excel at the national level while the swac only strived to be the best hbcu in the swac. the “quitter bowl” will lower the bar to the swac’s level for the meac. i’m predicting that the meac’s dominance over the swac will now come to an end. 2 – i think meac coaches “more aggressively” went after better talent than the swac because we had a higher bar to get over. meac coaches were bending over backwards trying to win a playoff game, swac coaches were just trying to be the best team in the swac. by default, i think indeed a selling point for our coaches was to tell recruits they had an opportunity to play against the best in the playoffs. so i beg to differ on the ideal that most of our athletes rather play a swac team in a bowl game just to be on tv over playing in the playoffs. why? because many of these guys have their eyes on playing at the next level and to prepare for the next level, guys have to compete against “the best”... OSA I have to disagree . I think the SWAC pulled out of the playoffs because the saw that the landscape had changed in favor of the bigger well funded white schools in their region. If you look at it you will see that. You have a number of schools in La that either didn't have football or we're just starting football with well funded programs. That dip into there recruiting pool. they just have to forsyth to see what was coming. saabman, i didn't really address "why" the swac pulled out of the playoffs. i only addressed the "results" of them pulling out of the playoffs...
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Post by aggieepower1990 on Mar 20, 2015 12:06:31 GMT -5
I'm curious. Who on here that's complaining about this bowl really thinks we'd get past the first round of the playoffs if we played any non-hbcu? I mean ever. I'm not for the bowl myself, but I ain't against it either. Makes logical and financial sense, but so do a few other solutions. I guess that I'm mostly for it. My cocnern is not that we are going to a HBCU bowl in liu of FCS payoffs, but are the parties involved, ESPN and 100 Black Men, the right team for the MEAC and SWAC? I faintly remember that there were issues with the Aggie-Eagle Classic and the 100 over funds disperements ($100k) at one time that did not eneded up too good, at least in the media and legally. I am sure that there are prominant Aggies in the 100, but is the 100 looking out for the best interst of HBCU's? The same for ESPN. Will we get our fair share of the success.....I am sure we will get the bill if it is a bust. Look at the CIAA and how that conference is still suffering with the best tournament in the country.
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Post by DOOMS on Mar 20, 2015 12:11:23 GMT -5
Which 100 Black Men stiffed us? Was it national or local. I believe there's a national group and then there are local groups. I assume we got stiffed by a local and that the national is behind this bowl.
When I saw their involvement I saw something good that could plausibly come out of the game. One of their main goals is getting kids to college that otherwise wouldn't go. The game seems like a good way for them to assist in achieving that goal. It may involve filling those sure to be empty seats with high school kids and their families. That type of goodwill doesn't hurt.
As far as believing we can win in the playoffs when we're almost certain to be the lower-funded team with a coaching staff that's never won a playoff game at a school that only won one playoff game which was played against another hbcu and their third string qb and was demolished in every other playoff game... Well, I admire y'alls faith.
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oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Mar 20, 2015 12:21:40 GMT -5
speaking for myself, i’m not that concerned with whether we win in the playoffs or not. i mean, of course i desperately want to win a playoff game, but that’s not the most important thing to me. i guess i’m a little different from most other folks, but i “fully” and “completely” understand why hbcu’s struggle in the playoffs. so given the historical disadvantages of hbcu’s, i’m not at all embarrassed to lose a playoff game.
yet, at the same time i’d prefer the right to continue fighting to win a playoff game. i mean, i can already hear what folks are gonna say once we have a dominant team that can’t go to the playoffs. they’re gonna be saying, “i wonder how this great team of ours could’ve done in the playoffs?” i mean, just let our aggies rip up every hbcu and pwc (other than unc) on our schedule next season and then see what aggies will be saying? if we only lose 1 game next season, folk will be “whining” because we’ll never know if our team could be the one to win a playoff game.
i mean, look at this way? no hbcu in the entire history of the ncaa had advanced to the d2 ncaa national championship game until connell maynor and bill hayes came along. heck, hardly any had ever won a playoff game, much less the national championship. just imagine what folks would’ve said had maynor and hayes not been given an opportunity to go to the playoffs? i mean, the record of d2 hbcu’s in the playoffs had been just as embarrassing at the d2 level as it has been at the fcs level! yet, one day an hbcu finally puts it together enough to make a legit run for a national championship.
i know the odds are against hbcu’s in the playoffs, but for me, winning playoff games is not the biggest issue because i completely understand why it is that way. my main thing is not being “pigeon holed” into a corner and not being allowed to be a “fully active member” of the fcs. i’m extremely proud to be an hbcu, but i don’t like being labelled an hbcu “only” and i don’t like being labelled a “QUITTER”...
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Post by Aggie One on Mar 20, 2015 12:41:54 GMT -5
OSA I have to disagree . I think the SWAC pulled out of the playoffs because the saw that the landscape had changed in favor of the bigger well funded white schools in their region. If you look at it you will see that. You have a number of schools in La that either didn't have football or we're just starting football with well funded programs. That dip into there recruiting pool. they just have to forsyth to see what was coming. saabman, i didn't really address "why" the swac pulled out of the playoffs. i only addressed the "results" of them pulling out of the playoffs... Truth of the matter is the SWAC pulled out of the playoffs to protect their multimillion dollar deal with NBC to telecast the Bayou Classic which was and still is their premier sporting event that rakes in huge bucks for their conference. The only relationship to the playoffs was a demand by the NCAA for the SWAC to move Bayou date so it would not conflict with the start date of the playoffs which was the same date. The SWAC refused and decided to forego the AQ rather than upset their golden goose. Since the initial pullout the SWAC has had their second place team receive at large berth a couple of times over the years. The pullout had nothing to do with competition. It was always about money. The wording in the MEAC press release was quite specific and it stated clearly that the champions must represent their respective conference in this game. It would be highly unlikely that any second place team would get at large bid unless they otherwise ran the rest of the table in high fashionand were ranked probably as one of the Top 15 teams at the end of the regular season.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Mar 20, 2015 12:56:50 GMT -5
We're doing a lot of talking about the SWAC and arguing why the MEAC should stay in the playoffs.......
......but once again, we really need to focus our attention on the "pay-for-home-game" conundrum, which continues to baffle me. I still don't see how any FCS football program can seriously tell me they are serious about winning in the playoffs when they don't even put in a bid to host a home game. To me, this is one of the biggest issues that faces MEAC programs.
If you want to win, but don't even put in a 5-figure bid for a home game................YOU'RE SELLING WOLF TICKETS TO ME. There's a whole bunch of grandiose playoff talk going on, but when it's time for a check to be written for a home game, there ain't no ink pens around...... And if that's the case, you really have no business turning your nose up at a black conference bowl game where you're virtually guaranteed some form of payday.
We keep sweeping this issue under the rug when we talk about playoff participation.....but to me this is OBSTACLE #1!!! IF YOU AIN'T PAYING TO PLAY A HOME GAME, YOU REALLY AREN'T AS SERIOUS ABOUT WINNING IN THE PLAYOFFS AS YOU SAY YOU ARE......
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DECKS
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Post by DECKS on Mar 20, 2015 15:45:03 GMT -5
We won't get 30k in the Ga Dome unless the SWAC school brings the numbers. Heck, we barely got 20k in the Ga Dome to see our game vs SCSU and most of the folks were their fans. I'm actually hoping we finish in second place with a good enough record for an at-large berth. Why though? You would rather go see us lose to a playoff team(dont fool yourself, if we finish 2nd in the MEAC it will be a L in the 1st round) than go play for a bowl championship with a good chance of winning? Slim chance but yes I do beleive it would be possible. Broadway has his share of success vs PWC's and I beleive he is building us to a point where we'd have a legit chance to win a playoff game.
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Post by marchingband1969 on Mar 20, 2015 16:45:21 GMT -5
I'm curious. Who on here that's complaining about this bowl really thinks we'd get past the first round of the playoffs if we played any non-hbcu? I mean ever. I'm not for the bowl myself, but I ain't against it either. Makes logical and financial sense, but so do a few other solutions. I guess that I'm mostly for it. My cocnern is not that we are going to a HBCU bowl in liu of FCS payoffs, but are the parties involved, ESPN and 100 Black Men, the right team for the MEAC and SWAC? I faintly remember that there were issues with the Aggie-Eagle Classic and the 100 over funds disperements ($100k) at one time that did not eneded up too good, at least in the media and legally. I am sure that there are prominant Aggies in the 100, but is the 100 looking out for the best interst of HBCU's? The same for ESPN. Will we get our fair share of the success.....I am sure we will get the bill if it is a bust. Look at the CIAA and how that conference is still suffering with the best tournament in the country. The CIAA is suffering not because anyone is taking advantage of them but because of it's own incompetency. And I don't know what you can do about the current situation when the majority of your fans show up in town for the parties, not the tournament games. Their fans want to party and could care less about the games. Who's fault is that. Cannot blame that on the sponsors or promoters. Maybe if the CIAA teams were forced to sell out all the game tickets, more money would be made on the tournament. As a former member of the Charlotte 100 Black Men, I can discuss the issue with the A&T vs. SC State game a few years ago. The expenses for that game were astronomical. Memorial Stadium was too small to accommodate the game and Panther Stadium was at that time $225,000 to rent. So with that $225,000 expense add $300,000 the two schools demanded ($150,000 each) now you're over $525,000 before the game even starts. Some local sponsors kicked in some money but not nearly enough to cover all of the upfront expenses. So the only way for the 100 Black Men of Charlotte to make any money off of that game was to sell lots of tickets. And here's the kicker, Both A&T and SC State refused to sell any tickets! They wanted to show up, eat a free meal, stay in the hotel, play the game and leave with $150,000 guarantee. Without the schools promoting and selling tickets, there was no way the 100 Black Men would be able to sell enough tickets to make a profit. The game was essentially a fundraiser for the 100 Black Men's youth program. They provide ongoing mentoring for junior high and high school males and a guaranteed college scholarship of $10,000 per student. How many organizations do you know that can raise over $500,000 every year without some help? So after nearly losing money one year the game was cancelled. For some reason, HBCU football fans believe that these organizations are swindling these schools and pocketing massive amounts of money. Maybe that's why opportunities for HBCU events like this are disappearing. Now we somehow think ESPN is ripping off the SWAC and MEAC with this Celebration Bowl. I'm sure ESPN is going to make money for itself...all we need to do is figure out how to get paid too.
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KidHeartless
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Post by KidHeartless on Mar 20, 2015 16:47:04 GMT -5
Why though? You would rather go see us lose to a playoff team(dont fool yourself, if we finish 2nd in the MEAC it will be a L in the 1st round) than go play for a bowl championship with a good chance of winning? Slim chance but yes I do beleive it would be possible. Broadway has his share of success vs PWC's and I beleive he is building us to a point where we'd have a legit chance to win a playoff game. i'll vote playoffs
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Gator
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Post by Gator on Mar 20, 2015 17:58:57 GMT -5
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't BCU host Coastal Carolina a few years ago in the FCS playoffs?
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KidHeartless
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Post by KidHeartless on Mar 20, 2015 18:04:47 GMT -5
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't BCU host Coastal Carolina a few years ago in the FCS playoffs? yup
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Gator
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Post by Gator on Mar 20, 2015 18:08:20 GMT -5
I'm not sure if the hosting argument holds-up anymore.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2015 18:11:01 GMT -5
I still haven't heard anyone say that we cannot participate in both the FCS playoffs and the bowl game........the bowl game's on Dec 19th. Mutiple rounds of playoff games will have occurred before the game hits the schedule. Furthermore, there are multiple weeks between the semifinals and finals of the FCS playoffs. Looking at the North Dakota St schedule last year, the semifinals were played on Dec 19th, while the finals were played on Jan 10th. I do believe there should be a way where this bowl game could be scheduled in the 3-week period between the FCS semi and final games. Theoretically, we could have our cake and eat it, too...... That's not happening.
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Gator
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Post by Gator on Mar 20, 2015 18:17:16 GMT -5
What if we depart the MEAC and just be on independent status in football only? I think this will work in our favor. This will allow us to compete freely and establish our true value as a program.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Mar 20, 2015 19:42:10 GMT -5
I'm not sure if the hosting argument holds-up anymore. Ask North Dakota State if hosting games doesn't hold up. Ask Appalachian State if hosting all of those games during its runs didn't hold up. I said it when it was discussed months ago, hosting games doesn't guarantee playoff victories, but I think we are being naive if we think travelling up and down the road to other people's stadiums from the jump is a recipe for playoff success. Many of the MEAC teams simply haven't been good enough to beat the better teams in the FCS......whether it be at home, neutral or away. However, if A&T wins the MEAC in football and our program is seriously trying to do whatever possible to increase our chances of winning a playoff game, you realistically cannot tell me that you would like our chances better playing at someone else's home. I just don't buy that one. To me, it's about doing whatever possible to enhance your chances of winning. GIVE ME AGGIE STADIUM FOR ROUND ONE OF THE PLAYOFFS PLEASE....
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