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Post by aggiebred09 on Oct 9, 2006 14:26:37 GMT -5
We are all the way back to nothing. Its dissapointing. A loss at home to a team that hasnt done shyt since the 70s...Fobbs you got some explaining to do!
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Post by krazykev on Oct 9, 2006 14:43:44 GMT -5
AggieBred09 Why are you so hard on Fobbs? Everybody knows he doesn't have much to work with this year. We need to be looking for George Small's azz instead!!!!!!!!
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Post by DOOMS on Oct 9, 2006 15:18:40 GMT -5
You can't place all the blame on George Small. He'd have won at least two or three were he still coach. The current infrastructure of the athletic department as a whole is to blame. And the athletic department has not been given a damn thing to work with in years.
If you haven't noticed we haven't been winning at much of anything lately. Could it be because the administration has short-changed athletics to pay for such necessary items as award-winning comic strips and barbecues to recruit students?
The basic problem is we don't have money to compete in division I yet we refuse to admit it. Some people cry the alumni should step up. Well if 40,000 people with car notes, food bills, and basic living expenses all care enough to donate 100 bucks a year each then you have a third of what we would need to be moderately successful. Obviously we ain't getting it from the alumni. We gonna blame Small for that too? Hell, we shouldn't even have to ask the alumni for that money.
Instead we ask a running back coach to be head coach and offensive coordinator, take his defensive coordinator away, make him hire dudes younger than me and almost as inexperienced to boot, and tell him to go put a respectable team on the field with guys who probably don't really have the heart for this crap anymore. That's not division I athletics. That's igga isht.
On the bright side it's not going to be this bad forever. Sooner than you realize we'll be back to the good ole days of 8-3 and losses to any pwc we face, visiting classics and losing in the first round of the playoffs every now and again.
That's the goal, right?
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Post by TOPPDOGG on Oct 9, 2006 21:14:58 GMT -5
You can't place all the blame on George Small. He'd have won at least two or three were he still coach. The current infrastructure of the athletic department as a whole is to blame. And the athletic department has not been given a damn thing to work with in years. If you haven't noticed we haven't been winning at much of anything lately. Could it be because the administration has short-changed athletics to pay for such necessary items as award-winning comic strips and barbecues to recruit students? The basic problem is we don't have money to compete in division I yet we refuse to admit it. Some people cry the alumni should step up. Well if 40,000 people with car notes, food bills, and basic living expenses all care enough to donate 100 bucks a year each then you have a third of what we would need to be moderately successful. Obviously we ain't getting it from the alumni. We gonna blame Small for that too? Hell, we shouldn't even have to ask the alumni for that money. Instead we ask a running back coach to be head coach and offensive coordinator, take his defensive coordinator away, make him hire dudes younger than me and almost as inexperienced to boot, and tell him to go put a respectable team on the field with guys who probably don't really have the heart for this crap anymore. That's not division I athletics. That's igga isht. On the bright side it's not going to be this bad forever. Sooner than you realize we'll be back to the good ole days of 8-3 and losses to any pwc we face, visiting classics and losing in the first round of the playoffs every now and again. That's the goal, right? Aren't we spending more than Morgan? More than Norfolk? More than SC State? The Aggie club has given over $400,000 in the last 3 years alone. What other HBCU can come close to saying the same? Yes our program needs more, but I refuse to believe money is the only problem or the only answer. Coach Small was recruiting tenors for his choir when he should've been recruiting ballers for the team. It's inexcusable. The cupboard is bare. Coach Small should never show his a$$ on campus again! We just have to face the fact that we're starting over from scratch. We need to give more, but more than that be patient with the new coach. He can turn it around.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Oct 9, 2006 21:55:57 GMT -5
Like I said before: Small's new name is "The Great Destroyer".
I hope he can rest easy at night knowing that he totally decimated his own alma mater.
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trues
Official BDF member
Posts: 4,322
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Post by trues on Oct 9, 2006 21:56:53 GMT -5
I totally agree Thrilla
Dooms the last time I check our budget ranks number 7. Out of 12 meac school. So we are not number one but we have 5 other school that has a lower budget.
As I say when Hayes was the coach our budget was problem the same as it is now. But he still ended up to be the winner nest coach in the MEAC. So money is not everything.
But I understand money can improve your program.
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Post by DOOMS on Oct 10, 2006 6:44:06 GMT -5
We're not spending more than Norfolk or SC State of football. We're a mill less than SC State alone. I don't know about Morgan but I'm willing to bet this year we're spending less. 400,000 in three years wouldn't fund a division III program. That's nothing to brag about. You see, 40,000 times 100 dollars a year is 4 million dollars a year. That would be a third of what we would need to be truly nationally competitive on a yearly basis given our built in disadvantages (we don't really hire or recruit outside of black people and our schedule is full of teams that do the same and underfund their programs). That being said we take the money we do get and do dumb isht with it like collapsing positions and putting names on jerseys. Ahem. Small didn't fire Hayes. Small didn't hire Small. Small didn't fire Scandrett. Small didn't keep the budget the same for the past eight years or so. Small didn't replace himself with a running back coach and make him head coach and offensive coordinator. You can't logically blame George Small singlehandedly for the demise of this program. Of course I do have to consider the audience I'm dealing with. Like somebody would purposely destroy his alma mater's football program. He only did what he knew how to do, which was coach and recruit to the best of his ability. Which is the same thing any other coach will do. His resume had a losing record on it when we hired him. He had the exact same pattern at Kentucky State that he did with A&T. Not to mention his mother died. After my mother died I settled every case I had for three months. If my clients would have had the ufckin' nerve to say a got damn thing to me... Anyway, all he did was submit a resume. He shouldn't have been hired but now all this is his fault? No folks, this program is suffering from mismanagement starting at the very top of the school. And until you realize that and quit blaming people that didn't have much to do with it it will continue to suffer.
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Post by TOPPDOGG on Oct 10, 2006 7:08:31 GMT -5
We're not spending more than Norfolk or SC State of football. We're a mill less than SC State alone. I don't know about Morgan but I'm willing to bet this year we're spending less. The most recent gender-equity stats that are available indicate that we indeed are spending more on football than half the conference. If you have some different stats, let's see 'em.
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Post by DOOMS on Oct 10, 2006 7:12:45 GMT -5
I don't have different stats and I don't have the most recent stats. Let's see yours. In fact, let's see them for the past five years. One year's fluctuation up or down won't make much of a difference. It usually takes a good three years before you really see positive or negative movement in the program based on expenditures.
My point remains blaming Small is ignoring the real problem. That will make the real problem continue. Ten years from now our asses will still be doormats and you'll still be blaming Small and Hunter.
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Post by TOPPDOGG on Oct 10, 2006 7:13:26 GMT -5
400,000 in three years wouldn't fund a division III program. That's nothing to brag about. You see, 40,000 times 100 dollars a year is 4 million dollars a year. That would be a third of what we would need to be truly nationally competitive on a yearly basis given our built in disadvantages (we don't really hire or recruit outside of black people and our schedule is full of teams that do the same and underfund their programs). That being said we take the money we do get and do dumb isht with it like collapsing positions and putting names on jerseys. We need to give more. I concede that point. However, we fund our program as well as and better than most other HBCUs. Yet I don't think there is one other HBCU save SSU that we could beat. Money didn't get us to this point. It was mismanagement by administrators and coach Small.
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Post by DOOMS on Oct 10, 2006 7:19:21 GMT -5
Let me spell it out.
Who hired Small?
The administrators.
But why'd they hire him?
He came cheap and was willing to sign a pathetic contract in order to help out his alma mater.
Who refused to even interview or contact one of the top division III coaches in the nation (who's program is undefeated again this year) after he expressed interest and enthusiasm?
The administrators.
Why?
Not going there on a public forum.
Who didn't contact him again when the job opened up?
The adminstrators.
Why?
See above answer.
Who didn't raise the athletic dept budget one dime in years?
The administrators.
Why?
Cause they knew dumb iggas would blame the coaches.
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Post by aggiejazz on Oct 10, 2006 7:41:50 GMT -5
People who live in the Norfolk, VA area knows how bad Norfolk State football was a short two years ago. The athletic department was deep in the red for even longer back and they had a knowledgeable coach, Mo Forte, that kept the football program dreading water but no one at the time was coming to the games.
The Preident and AD wanted a change and made a hire that blew up in their face three weeks later. This gave the CIAA old head alumni a chance to make a bad situation worst and they forced AD Moss to hire an alumnus and offensive coordinator in the CIAA, Gillus. But that wasn't enough, the old heads had Gillus hire two or three local high school coaches as position coaches. Gullus look good to the ladies and had the talk. Gillus was clueless as a head coach and the program sunk even lower. Gillus first year he won 2 games and his second year he won 1 game. The President saw that this was not going to do and acted quickly.
The President re-asserted herself. She pulled a Machevalli act to get rid of the coach and hired someone that had a more postive track record as a coordinator. The new coach raided his old shop and by the second game of his first year you saw a real positive change. The program is still rebuilding in his second year, looking better but NSU still may never win the conference championship during his tenure.
The MEAC is no joke, conference still may lose in the first round of the playoff but if a head coach is just HBCU average and don't have a good coaching staff you will look really bad in this conference. And when you thought things can't get any worst like in Norfolk State case of 5-6 or 4-7, low and behold you make the wrong change and you are 2-9 and 1-10.
All of this to say a very good coaching staff with little money will keep you on a level of a 5-6 to 7-4 season. A very good coaching staff with enough money will win you championships.
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Post by TOPPDOGG on Oct 10, 2006 7:42:58 GMT -5
I don't believe Coach Small should be absolved of his shortcomings, just because the administrators with their own shortcomings made the mistake of hiring him.
Coach Small has to shoulder the blame for those things that were within his control. For example, the penalties, the lack of fundamentals displayed by his players, poor recruiting (in-state where money isn't an issue) and his overall poor coaching acumen.
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Post by Aggie Monster on Oct 10, 2006 7:51:21 GMT -5
Finally, somebody said it! "In-State recruiting is NOT affected by money." There is almost limited travel and time involved. Established relationships and the coaches will just send you the players.
We lose tons of good in-state recruits to schools that shouldn't hold a candle to us. I know several High School coaches. My damn dad was a head coach for over 10 years. He is now in his firs year as an AD in Wake county. He NEVER had a relationship with A&T. Why, because they never tried. He knews Hayes a little, but no one after that.
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Post by DOOMS on Oct 10, 2006 8:04:39 GMT -5
I don't believe Coach Small should be absolved of his shortcomings, just because the administrators with their own shortcomings made the mistake of hiring him. Coach Small has to shoulder the blame for those things that were within his control. For example, the penalties, the lack of fundamentals displayed by his players, poor recruiting (in-state where money isn't an issue) and his overall poor coaching acumen. Don't absolve him but quit blaming him for every damn thing. His penalty getting, no fundamentals teaching, non-recruiting, poor coaching a$$ won a championship. Yes they weren't his players, but the guy whose players they were went 4-7 with the same dudes and wouldn't have won 10 with them a year later. I was the very first person to question the man's coaching acumen (that I know of) openly when we failed to adjust against the same damn screen play over and over at the Southern game. Again, we knew what we would get before he was hired. Now he's gone and instead of figuring out what the real problems are we just point fingers at him. He's gone. Blaming him isn't going to get us a win any more than blaming Hunter is going to get us to 10 wins in basketball. What hbcu coach doesn't have a team that gets a ton of penalties and have players lacking fundamentals? He was supposedly a poor in-state recruiter but most of the guys he brought in were in-state and were lauded on this website like they were about to be pros. The same criticisms (except poor recruiting) could be made about Hayes and in hindsight he knew a lot more than anybody posting or reading this board does about winning at this school. I don't know exactly why, but when you cut money you will lose and when you increase money substantially you will win. That's why Cookman came from nowhere to become a player and now that they cut the money a few years ago, look at 'em. The same can be said of dozens of schools. Hampton basketball, Howard football, Albany State, JC Smith, the list goes on and on. We don't pay attention and waste time blaming people that no longer have a bearing on things. As far as recruiting, I don't know how it works. I wasn't recruited. I always thought if a coach wanted a player he came and talked to the high school coach and told him he wanted him and the high school coach funneled the kid where he wanted him to go. At least that's how it happened at my school.
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