The greatest BB player in A&T history

[aggie2ru]

Mar 21, 2012 16:37:06 GMT -5 aggiedoe1 said:

Man, I have seen players from back in the early 60's to present and Bird is barely in the top
top ten if at all.

Al Attles
June Harris
George Mack
Allen Spruill
Joe Binion
Daryl Cherry
James Outlaw
Joe Powell
Ted Campbell
Al Carter
Bird - Maybe

Also, you forgot about the great Joe Cotton, Jerry Powell, Hugh Evans, Carl Hubbard, Maurice "Toothpick in His Mouth While He Played" (was sooooooo sweet he NEVER lost it during a game)McHartley, Soapy Adams, Warren "Big D" Davis................

[aggie2ru]

Mar 21, 2012 16:42:08 GMT -5 oleschoolaggie said:

Mar 21, 2012 16:32:31 GMT -5 pj said:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
dude was just fun to watch. unfortunately, he came along at a time when folk didn't have video cameras and the internet. quote]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oleschool reminded me
4XL did you run across an 'u-matic' video tapes of championship games? I remember seeing a Spruill vs Marvin Webster game on a big videotape player in the student union. They had it on repeat.

I also remember seeing images of great players on the wall somewhere. ..even Joe Faust I believe.

pj, al spruiell was my homeboy, but i never got to see him play at a&t. i watched him play when i was a snotty nosed little kid when he was in high school and he was nothing but the truth! he too was a very exciting offensive player! i would love to see footage of him playing at a&t! he might have to be in the conversation as one of the best offensive players.

we use to read a bunch of newspaper articles on him when he was at a&t. but i never got to see him play in an aggie uniform. would luv to see that...

Spruiell was no joke he had enough talent for 2 mama tama's.

[aggie2ru]

Mar 21, 2012 16:53:49 GMT -5 saabman said:

I said all around player scoring and defense!! Mr B informed me that Attles could have scored any time he wanted to but that he was a HEADED PLAYER and that was what set him apart from the other players that A&T have had. He also stated that Attles was more physical with and with out the ball. As you no you could hand check back in the day.

I could not have explained it better myself.

That was Cal Irvin's homeboy from Newark, NJ and he was a coach on the floor.

[aggie2ru]

I ain't gon lie....I'm gittin hyped thinkin bout back in da day! Mama, just peeped me lacing my chuck taylor's and seen the look in my eye......she went and locked da door.

She said, "My n*g use a grown azzzz man. You can go out on the court and hurt yourself and can't bring me my money....you done seen a bad day."

Lawd have mussy on my soul!

AGGIE PRIDE

[aggiedoe1]

best player in the past 10 years ..... ?

[Aggie77]

Mar 21, 2012 16:32:37 GMT -5 aggie2ru said:

You didn't get in the NBA back in that day of time by not being able to score. Just think about it. That was 1961! Al WAS NOT a brick mason he led A&T in scoring.

Let me say this think 1961, think 1961, think 1961.....how many players were even in the NBA from a HBCU in 1961?

Enough said!

I'm not sure what you are basing that on, but here's quote from an interesting article about Al "The Destroyer" Attles.

"Attles had the shooting touch of a blacksmith, but the Warriors needed his speed to catch the run-run Celtics."

Read more: www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/10/SPC61BGBF5.DTL#ixzz1pnvIHc1U

What year do you think Al led A&T in scoring?
57-58 - probably Joe Howell
58-59 - probably Henry Marshall
59-60 - probably Henry Marshall

Here's top 25 Aggies Scoring Leaders, no Al.

Top Career - Point Scorers
1. Joe Binion - 2,143
2. James Sparrow - 1,986
3. Claude Williams - 1,648
4. Joe Howell - 1,602
5. William “June” Harris - 1,549
6. Eric Boyd - 1,528
7. Glenn Taggart – 1,518
8. James Outlaw - 1,501
9. Bruce Jenkins - 1,487
10. Elmer Austin - 1,478
11. Carlton Becton - 1,379
12. Dana Elliot - 1,355
13. George Cale - 1,339
14. Jason Wills - 1,262
15 Thomas Griffi s - 1,248
16 Jimmy Brown - 1,236
17 Phillip Allen - 1,221
18. Joe Brawner - 1,215
19. James Jackson - 1,178
20. Allen Spruill - 1,132
21. Jonathan Richmond - 1,078
22. Al Carter ’69-‘72 - 1,068
23. Steven Koger - 1,061
24. Henry Marshall - 1,046
25. Jamaine Williams - 1,045

Here's Al career % shooting stats in the NBA.
FG% - .451
FT% - .632

Here's where Al excelled!

ASSISTS
Name Years Assists
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 582
2. Al Attles ’57-60 581
3. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 505
4. Eric Boyd ’81-85 362
5. Joe Brawner ’77-80 296
6. Tavarus Alston ’06-10 288
7. J.J. Miller ’97-01 286
8.Marque Carrington ’97-02 277
9. Corvin Davis ’85-89 236
T10. Marcus Williams ’95-97 221

STEALS
Name Years Steals
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 261
2. Phillip Allen ’91-‘95 223
3. Joe Brawner ’77-80 210
4. Al Attles ’57-‘60 200
5. Claude Williams ’83-‘88 196
6. Eric Boyd ’81-‘85 170
6. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 170
8. Joe Binion ’80-‘84 168
9. Marque Carrington ’97-‘02 162
10. George Cale ’83-‘87 152

Like I said this is first time I'm hearing Al Attles and offense in the same sentence. This reminds of that story some poster was telling about The Pearl being in school at A&T for a month before going to Winston. But I never heard that Destroyer nickname before either.

[oleschoolaggie]

Mar 21, 2012 18:01:04 GMT -5 saabman said:

Mar 21, 2012 16:36:15 GMT -5 oleschoolaggie said:

i've never seen attles play, so i can't comment on him. but i saw bird play for 3 years and i love defense, so i always pay close attention to defensive play. no, i wouldn't exactly say bird played "matador" defense. otherwise, he wouldn't have been in the game very long. but i have no images whatsoever of bird being in a proper "defensive stance" that i can recollect.

when bird played, we had a lot of "size" in our front court. so he could afford to take risks going after steals. he had a 6'10" shot blocking center playing behind him and 2 high jumping forwards 6'9" (pimpkin) and 6'8" (ron johnson) to back him up.

let's just say that defense was not a priority for bird. like i previously posted, bird's front line were all tremendous defenders. it was clear to me that if we needed a stop, bird would not be the guy you'd look to. seriously, he wasn't a very good defender because he didn't put forth 100% effort to play defense. you can go an entire game not guarding someone, but still lead your team in steals. so i wouldn't use steals as an indicator of how well someone plays defense...

t
The stoppers were Stan Wolfman Parham, Ray Perry,Ron Johnson, Sinclair Colbert, lon smith and Vince Buter they set the tone for the defense.

ray perry! that's the point guard's name, right? i couldn't think of his name. man, that was a very talented team with perry, sparrow, pimpkin, johnson, and colbert. we may not have ever had a better overall starting five...

[saabman]

Mar 21, 2012 21:05:44 GMT -5 Aggie77 said:

Mar 21, 2012 16:32:37 GMT -5 aggie2ru said:

You didn't get in the NBA back in that day of time by not being able to score. Just think about it. That was 1961! Al WAS NOT a brick mason he led A&T in scoring.

Let me say this think 1961, think 1961, think 1961.....how many players were even in the NBA from a HBCU in 1961?

Enough said!

Like I said all around ball player Al Attles. You made my point for me Thank you ;D

I'm not sure what you are basing that on, but here's quote from an interesting article about Al "The Destroyer" Attles.

"Attles had the shooting touch of a blacksmith, but the Warriors needed his speed to catch the run-run Celtics."

Read more: www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/10/SPC61BGBF5.DTL#ixzz1pnvIHc1U

What year do you think Al led A&T in scoring?
57-58 - probably Joe Howell
58-59 - probably Henry Marshall
59-60 - probably Henry Marshall

Here's top 25 Aggies Scoring Leaders, no Al.

Top Career - Point Scorers
1. Joe Binion - 2,143
2. James Sparrow - 1,986
3. Claude Williams - 1,648
4. Joe Howell - 1,602
5. William “June” Harris - 1,549
6. Eric Boyd - 1,528
7. Glenn Taggart – 1,518
8. James Outlaw - 1,501
9. Bruce Jenkins - 1,487
10. Elmer Austin - 1,478
11. Carlton Becton - 1,379
12. Dana Elliot - 1,355
13. George Cale - 1,339
14. Jason Wills - 1,262
15 Thomas Griffi s - 1,248
16 Jimmy Brown - 1,236
17 Phillip Allen - 1,221
18. Joe Brawner - 1,215
19. James Jackson - 1,178
20. Allen Spruill - 1,132
21. Jonathan Richmond - 1,078
22. Al Carter ’69-‘72 - 1,068
23. Steven Koger - 1,061
24. Henry Marshall - 1,046
25. Jamaine Williams - 1,045

Here's Al career % shooting stats in the NBA.
FG% - .451
FT% - .632

Here's where Al excelled!

ASSISTS
Name Years Assists
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 582
2. Al Attles ’57-60 581
3. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 505
4. Eric Boyd ’81-85 362
5. Joe Brawner ’77-80 296
6. Tavarus Alston ’06-10 288
7. J.J. Miller ’97-01 286
8.Marque Carrington ’97-02 277
9. Corvin Davis ’85-89 236
T10. Marcus Williams ’95-97 221

STEALS
Name Years Steals
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 261
2. Phillip Allen ’91-‘95 223
3. Joe Brawner ’77-80 210
4. Al Attles ’57-‘60 200
5. Claude Williams ’83-‘88 196
6. Eric Boyd ’81-‘85 170
6. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 170
8. Joe Binion ’80-‘84 168
9. Marque Carrington ’97-‘02 162
10. George Cale ’83-‘87 152

Like I said this is first time I'm hearing Al Attles and offense in the same sentence. This reminds of that story some poster was telling about The Pearl being in school at A&T for a month before going to Winston. But I never heard that Destroyer nickname before either.

[aggie2ru]

Mar 21, 2012 21:05:44 GMT -5 Aggie77 said:

Mar 21, 2012 16:32:37 GMT -5 aggie2ru said:

You didn't get in the NBA back in that day of time by not being able to score. Just think about it. That was 1961! Al WAS NOT a brick mason he led A&T in scoring.

Let me say this think 1961, think 1961, think 1961.....how many players were even in the NBA from a HBCU in 1961?

Enough said!

I'm not sure what you are basing that on, but here's quote from an interesting article about Al "The Destroyer" Attles.

"Attles had the shooting touch of a blacksmith, but the Warriors needed his speed to catch the run-run Celtics."

Read more: www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/10/SPC61BGBF5.DTL#ixzz1pnvIHc1U

What year do you think Al led A&T in scoring?
57-58 - probably Joe Howell
58-59 - probably Henry Marshall
59-60 - probably Henry Marshall

Here's top 25 Aggies Scoring Leaders, no Al.

Top Career - Point Scorers
1. Joe Binion - 2,143
2. James Sparrow - 1,986
3. Claude Williams - 1,648
4. Joe Howell - 1,602
5. William “June” Harris - 1,549
6. Eric Boyd - 1,528
7. Glenn Taggart – 1,518
8. James Outlaw - 1,501
9. Bruce Jenkins - 1,487
10. Elmer Austin - 1,478
11. Carlton Becton - 1,379
12. Dana Elliot - 1,355
13. George Cale - 1,339
14. Jason Wills - 1,262
15 Thomas Griffi s - 1,248
16 Jimmy Brown - 1,236
17 Phillip Allen - 1,221
18. Joe Brawner - 1,215
19. James Jackson - 1,178
20. Allen Spruill - 1,132
21. Jonathan Richmond - 1,078
22. Al Carter ’69-‘72 - 1,068
23. Steven Koger - 1,061
24. Henry Marshall - 1,046
25. Jamaine Williams - 1,045

Here's Al career % shooting stats in the NBA.
FG% - .451
FT% - .632

Here's where Al excelled!

ASSISTS
Name Years Assists
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 582
2. Al Attles ’57-60 581
3. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 505
4. Eric Boyd ’81-85 362
5. Joe Brawner ’77-80 296
6. Tavarus Alston ’06-10 288
7. J.J. Miller ’97-01 286
8.Marque Carrington ’97-02 277
9. Corvin Davis ’85-89 236
T10. Marcus Williams ’95-97 221

STEALS
Name Years Steals
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 261
2. Phillip Allen ’91-‘95 223
3. Joe Brawner ’77-80 210
4. Al Attles ’57-‘60 200
5. Claude Williams ’83-‘88 196
6. Eric Boyd ’81-‘85 170
6. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 170
8. Joe Binion ’80-‘84 168
9. Marque Carrington ’97-‘02 162
10. George Cale ’83-‘87 152

Like I said this is first time I'm hearing Al Attles and offense in the same sentence. This reminds of that story some poster was telling about The Pearl being in school at A&T for a month before going to Winston. But I never heard that Destroyer nickname before either.

Very good info. My main contention was that Al led the team in scoring his last year, which was 1960. I am almost positive of this.
If you find out Henry "Hank" Marshall did please share. Al was not known as a scorer when he got to the NBA because he served (pt. guard) Wilt Chamberlin, who at that time, was averaging 45-50 per game, every game. When Wilt got the ball you didn't get it back in those days.

But if I have a point guard back then and even now who shot 45% from the field in the NBA, you got a good one. 63% from the line is not good, especially for someone 6'1".

The "greatest" to me is not defined by how much you score or entertain but how you play the game and how your play affects your teammates.

I know your point in fact is about Al being a "scorer". But simply the "greatest" to me has to be measured by what he did at Ayantee and what he did in the NBA. Back then you HAD to be great to even make the NBA (1961). As I mentioned previously, I'm curious to know how many other playas from a HBCU was in the NBA at that time. Not only did he make it.... he played for 11 seasons... his jersey was retired (only 6 Warriors have this honor), coached an NBA team (Warriors) for 14 yrs and won a NBA championship as coach, and GM for many years (Warriors).

In fact there is NO ONE from a HBCU that can claim what he has accomplished. But even if we just look at how great he was as a playa alone....what other playa from A&T played as long in the NBA as Al. What other playa meant as much to his team as the great Al Attles?

Also, Al scored a little less than Marshall for his career at A&T...Al scored 944 pts. but he scored his most his last year when Cal had him shooting more.

I guess it is how one defines greatness that counts.

[saabman]

Mar 21, 2012 21:05:44 GMT -5 Aggie77 said:

Mar 21, 2012 16:32:37 GMT -5 aggie2ru said:

You didn't get in the NBA back in that day of time by not being able to score. Just think about it. That was 1961! Al WAS NOT a brick mason he led A&T in scoring.

Let me say this think 1961, think 1961, think 1961.....how many players were even in the NBA from a HBCU in 1961?

Enough said!

I'm not sure what you are basing that on, but here's quote from an interesting article about Al "The Destroyer" Attles.

"Attles had the shooting touch of a blacksmith, but the Warriors needed his speed to catch the run-run Celtics."

Read more: www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/10/SPC61BGBF5.DTL#ixzz1pnvIHc1U

What year do you think Al led A&T in scoring?
57-58 - probably Joe Howell
58-59 - probably Henry Marshall
59-60 - probably Henry Marshall

Here's top 25 Aggies Scoring Leaders, no Al.

Top Career - Point Scorers
1. Joe Binion - 2,143
2. James Sparrow - 1,986
3. Claude Williams - 1,648
4. Joe Howell - 1,602
5. William “June” Harris - 1,549
6. Eric Boyd - 1,528
7. Glenn Taggart – 1,518
8. James Outlaw - 1,501
9. Bruce Jenkins - 1,487
10. Elmer Austin - 1,478
11. Carlton Becton - 1,379
12. Dana Elliot - 1,355
13. George Cale - 1,339
14. Jason Wills - 1,262
15 Thomas Griffi s - 1,248
16 Jimmy Brown - 1,236
17 Phillip Allen - 1,221
18. Joe Brawner - 1,215
19. James Jackson - 1,178
20. Allen Spruill - 1,132
21. Jonathan Richmond - 1,078
22. Al Carter ’69-‘72 - 1,068
23. Steven Koger - 1,061
24. Henry Marshall - 1,046
25. Jamaine Williams - 1,045

Here's Al career % shooting stats in the NBA.
FG% - .451
FT% - .632

Here's where Al excelled!

ASSISTS
Name Years Assists
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 582
2. Al Attles ’57-60 581
3. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 505
4. Eric Boyd ’81-85 362
5. Joe Brawner ’77-80 296
6. Tavarus Alston ’06-10 288
7. J.J. Miller ’97-01 286
8.Marque Carrington ’97-02 277
9. Corvin Davis ’85-89 236
T10. Marcus Williams ’95-97 221

STEALS
Name Years Steals
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 261
2. Phillip Allen ’91-‘95 223
3. Joe Brawner ’77-80 210
4. Al Attles ’57-‘60 200
5. Claude Williams ’83-‘88 196
6. Eric Boyd ’81-‘85 170
6. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 170
8. Joe Binion ’80-‘84 168
9. Marque Carrington ’97-‘02 162
10. George Cale ’83-‘87 152

Like I said this is first time I'm hearing Al Attles and offense in the same sentence. This reminds of that story some poster was telling about The Pearl being in school at A&T for a month before going to Winston. But I never heard that Destroyer nickname before either.

Your looking at scorers A77!! I'm talking about all around play.

[aggie2ru]

Bird was a talent and a even better guy.....good people. When he was at A&T he was king. Sparrow's negatives were he tuirned the green light to shoot.... BRIGHT green and would play outta control at times. He may have been the most flamboyant and spectacular playa ever at "T". On the court he had NY flare and showed arrogance and cockiness....off the court he was a down, cool dude.

I will never forget we were playing in the NIT Bird's last year and he got caught up in da moment and shot a hook shot from the top of the key in Madison Square Garden. Wuda been nice if he wuda made it!

I would say entertaining with great talent but not the "greatest".

[saabman]

At A&T: 1958-59: 9.2 ppg, Fg% .467 TRB 3.3 ,

1959-1960> 17.8 ppg, FG% .631, FT% . 662 , TRB 3.3

Career: G= 53, FG=295, FGA=526, FT= 103, FTA=163, TRB= 80, PTS= .693, FG% 561, FT% .636, PTS= 13.1, TRB= 3.3
www.basketball-reference.com/players/a/attleal01.html.
AL'S THE MAN!!
.

[aggierattler]

First of all, I thought that it was agreed that the focus had to be on the players' years at A&T.

Secondly, none of the old timers who saw him play at A&T that I talked to ever said that he was a Scoring Machine...but they all said that he completely controlled a game from end-to-end until the clock hit ZERO.

Lastly, black players who were signed by NBA teams had to be head-and-shoulders above any white players to make any roster back in the early 1960s...so Al Attles must have been NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH to stick and not lead the league is scoring or rebounding.

[saabman]

Al Attles is the man.

[aggierattler]

Mar 21, 2012 21:05:44 GMT -5 Aggie77 said:

Mar 21, 2012 16:32:37 GMT -5 aggie2ru said:

You didn't get in the NBA back in that day of time by not being able to score. Just think about it. That was 1961! Al WAS NOT a brick mason he led A&T in scoring.

Let me say this think 1961, think 1961, think 1961.....how many players were even in the NBA from a HBCU in 1961?

Enough said!

I'm not sure what you are basing that on, but here's quote from an interesting article about Al "The Destroyer" Attles.

"Attles had the shooting touch of a blacksmith, but the Warriors needed his speed to catch the run-run Celtics."

Read more: www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/10/SPC61BGBF5.DTL#ixzz1pnvIHc1U

What year do you think Al led A&T in scoring?
57-58 - probably Joe Howell
58-59 - probably Henry Marshall
59-60 - probably Henry Marshall

Here's top 25 Aggies Scoring Leaders, no Al.

Top Career - Point Scorers
1. Joe Binion - 2,143
2. James Sparrow - 1,986
3. Claude Williams - 1,648
4. Joe Howell - 1,602
5. William “June” Harris - 1,549
6. Eric Boyd - 1,528
7. Glenn Taggart – 1,518
8. James Outlaw - 1,501
9. Bruce Jenkins - 1,487
10. Elmer Austin - 1,478
11. Carlton Becton - 1,379
12. Dana Elliot - 1,355
13. George Cale - 1,339
14. Jason Wills - 1,262
15 Thomas Griffi s - 1,248
16 Jimmy Brown - 1,236
17 Phillip Allen - 1,221
18. Joe Brawner - 1,215
19. James Jackson - 1,178
20. Allen Spruill - 1,132
21. Jonathan Richmond - 1,078
22. Al Carter ’69-‘72 - 1,068
23. Steven Koger - 1,061
24. Henry Marshall - 1,046
25. Jamaine Williams - 1,045

Here's Al career % shooting stats in the NBA.
FG% - .451
FT% - .632

Here's where Al excelled!

ASSISTS
Name Years Assists
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 582
2. Al Attles ’57-60 581
3. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 505
4. Eric Boyd ’81-85 362
5. Joe Brawner ’77-80 296
6. Tavarus Alston ’06-10 288
7. J.J. Miller ’97-01 286
8.Marque Carrington ’97-02 277
9. Corvin Davis ’85-89 236
T10. Marcus Williams ’95-97 221

STEALS
Name Years Steals
1. Thomas Griffi s ’84-‘88 261
2. Phillip Allen ’91-‘95 223
3. Joe Brawner ’77-80 210
4. Al Attles ’57-‘60 200
5. Claude Williams ’83-‘88 196
6. Eric Boyd ’81-‘85 170
6. Glenn Taggart ’87-‘91 170
8. Joe Binion ’80-‘84 168
9. Marque Carrington ’97-‘02 162
10. George Cale ’83-‘87 152

Like I said this is first time I'm hearing Al Attles and offense in the same sentence. This reminds of that story some poster was telling about The Pearl being in school at A&T for a month before going to Winston. But I never heard that Destroyer nickname before either.

This is great information Aggie77, but I wish that you had provided the source.

However, the most fair thing to do is to give their PER-GAME AVERAGES...especially when talking about all-time leaders is scoring, assists, rebounds and steals. Some guys played on 20 or so games in an entire season, while others played over 30 games in a season for several seasons.