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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2020 12:33:47 GMT -5
If the Celebration Bowl continues, do not be surprised if A&T, Hampton and Tennessee State are eligible for a bowl invite against the SWAC Champ.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Sept 23, 2020 12:58:39 GMT -5
If the Celebration Bowl continues, do not be surprised if A&T, Hampton and Tennessee State are eligible for a bowl invite against the SWAC Champ. Why would the MEAC ever agree to that?
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Post by aggie2039 on Sept 23, 2020 12:59:57 GMT -5
If the Celebration Bowl continues, do not be surprised if A&T, Hampton and Tennessee State are eligible for a bowl invite against the SWAC Champ. Why would the MEAC ever agree to that? Because they have no leverage...they dont own the game, ESPN does. ESPN can invite whomever they want to participate.
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oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 23, 2020 13:09:52 GMT -5
If the Celebration Bowl continues, do not be surprised if A&T, Hampton and Tennessee State are eligible for a bowl invite against the SWAC Champ. that's ridiculous. the meac would "NEVER" agree to those terms and rightfully so. you folk who luv this bsc experiment can't have things "both ways". you want your cake and you want to eat it too. ya'll want to hug up with a bunch of pwc's in a pwc conference, but yet you also want all of the "benefits" of being in an hbcu conference...
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Post by Bornthrilla on Sept 23, 2020 13:12:48 GMT -5
So a MEAC team could go undefeated in conference play one season and still be passed over for a Celebration Bowl berth by a A&T or Tennessee State team?
Do you guys realize how silly that sounds? The CB was set up as a competition between the SWAC and MEAC champions.
The MEAC would just not participate if there was a chance that its champion could get shunned by the CB selection committee.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Sept 23, 2020 13:13:01 GMT -5
I'm gonna have to push back on some of this. If the MEAC champion has 1 or 2 losses, why would anyone think that A&T, Hampton or Tenn St would leapfrog that team to the CB? Suppose Hampton was 10-1 or 11-0 in the Big South last year; would they have leapfrogged A&T, with our 2 conference losses (FAMU, Morgan)?
Let's keep it real - we're doing all of this talking because now we're on the outside looking in, from an HBCU perspective. Folks are trying to have their cake and eat it too....you need to stop. We're going to the Big South. It is not an HBCU conference. We WILL NOT be looked at like a traditional HBCU has been ----- YOU (WE) HAVE TO ACCEPT THIS.
This is what change looks like - the change folks want may not be the actual change we get, especially when it comes to upholding a traditional HBCU brand.
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oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 23, 2020 13:15:38 GMT -5
Why would the MEAC ever agree to that? Because they have no leverage... the meac does have plenty of "leverage". if there's no meac, there's no celebration bowl, PERIOD. that's the meac's "leverage". removing the meac from the celebration bowl removes "legitimacy" from the idea that the winner of the celebration bowl will represent hbcu "national" champions. the bowl needs representation from the only 2 hbcu fcs conferences to retain its "legitimacy" to represent an hbcu "national" championship bowl game...
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Post by aggie2039 on Sept 23, 2020 13:32:02 GMT -5
Because they have no leverage... the meac does have plenty of "leverage". if there's no meac, there's no celebration bowl, PERIOD. that's the meac's "leverage". removing the meac from the celebration bowl removes "legitimacy" from the idea that the winner of the celebration bowl will represent hbcu "national" champions. the bowl needs representation from the only 2 hbcu fcs conferences to retain its "legitimacy" to represent an hbcu "national" championship bowl game... Says who? HBCU isn't a conference is a school designation. We have had plenty of HBCU national championships being awarded without a celebration bowl. There are three HBCUs outside of SWAC and MEAC that can lay claim to a title without having to be members of the conference. All Div1 HBCUs are ranked in polls throughout the season regardless of conference affiliation. The polls would need to exclude A&T, Hampton and TSU but those schools could still claim being HBCU national champs if they make a deep playoff run. In order for the bowl to be legitimate it needs the top teams regardless of conference affiliation.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Sept 23, 2020 13:45:44 GMT -5
I think you are getting some things confused.
First, the HBCU national champion has always been a mythical honor awarded by a consensus of respected voters.
Secondly, the Celebration Bowl was created by Disney to only to be a competition between the MEAC and SWAC champions. The MEAC and SWAC agreed to anoint the winner of that event as the HBCU national champion, but that is just an agreement between those two conferences.
Division Two HBCUs and other HBCU teams from different FCS conferences could technically make a claim for the mythical HBCU National Title, but just like FAMU found out this past year, the MEAC and SWAC are contractually obligated to recognize only the CB winner and most credentialed media members would likely not vote against the CB winner.
However, at the end of the day everything is subjective. The only official understanding is that the MEAC and SWAC conferences both agreed to recognize the CB winner as THEIR respective HBCU National Champion.
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oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 23, 2020 14:38:02 GMT -5
the meac does have plenty of "leverage". if there's no meac, there's no celebration bowl, PERIOD. that's the meac's "leverage". removing the meac from the celebration bowl removes "legitimacy" from the idea that the winner of the celebration bowl will represent hbcu "national" champions. the bowl needs representation from the only 2 hbcu fcs conferences to retain its "legitimacy" to represent an hbcu "national" championship bowl game... Says who? HBCU isn't a conference is a school designation. We have had plenty of HBCU national championships being awarded without a celebration bowl. There are three HBCUs outside of SWAC and MEAC that can lay claim to a title without having to be members of the conference. All Div1 HBCUs are ranked in polls throughout the season regardless of conference affiliation. The polls would need to exclude A&T, Hampton and TSU but those schools could still claim being HBCU national champs if they make a deep playoff run. In order for the bowl to be legitimate it needs the top teams regardless of conference affiliation. a&t, hampton, and tsu "WILL NOT" be representative of an entire hbcu conference which would render the legitimacy of an hbcu "national championship" bowl game useless. like i said, no meac, no celebration bowl as an hbcu national championship bowl game, PERIOD. ain't got jack to do with the "polls". if you don't win an hbcu conference championship, you cannot represent the vast majority of hbcu's in an hbcu conference. ain't gone happen, PERIOD. all that crap about "polls" is completely "irrelevant". if the meac were to pull out of the celebration bowl (if its renewed), then there would be no celebration bowl as currently known and that's the meac "leverage" that you say doesn't exist...
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Post by A&T-roy on Sept 23, 2020 14:41:19 GMT -5
I think you are getting some things confused. First, the HBCU national champion has always been a mythical honor awarded by a consensus of respected voters. Secondly, the Celebration Bowl was created by Disney to only to be a competition between the MEAC and SWAC champions. The MEAC and SWAC agreed to anoint the winner of that event as the HBCU national champion, but that is just an agreement between those two conferences. Division Two HBCUs and other HBCU teams from different FCS conferences could technically make a claim for the mythical HBCU National Title, but just like FAMU found out this past year, the MEAC and SWAC are contractually obligated to recognize only the CB winner and most credential media members would likely not vote against the CB winner. However, at the end of the day everything is subjective. The only official understanding is that the MEAC and SWAC conferences both agreed to recognize the CB winner as THEIR respective HBCU National Champion. I find it DIFFICULT to believe that any of the non-D1/FCS teams can beat the MEAC or SWAC champion. Also, Hampton & Tennessee St could have an argument but neither of them performed well enough during the 5 yrs of the Celebration Bowl to make a claim and/or get votes as champion.
Of course, I believe we're gonna get the votes required to win it when we go to the Big South!
Aggie Pride!
#AggiesDo
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oleschoolaggie
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Sept 23, 2020 14:42:43 GMT -5
I think you are getting some things confused. First, the HBCU national champion has always been a mythical honor awarded by a consensus of respected voters. Secondly, the Celebration Bowl was created by Disney to only to be a competition between the MEAC and SWAC champions. The MEAC and SWAC agreed to anoint the winner of that event as the HBCU national champion, but that is just an agreement between those two conferences. Division Two HBCUs and other HBCU teams from different FCS conferences could technically make a claim for the mythical HBCU National Title, but just like FAMU found out this past year, the MEAC and SWAC are contractually obligated to recognize only the CB winner and most credential media members would likely not vote against the CB winner. However, at the end of the day everything is subjective. The only official understanding is that the MEAC and SWAC conferences both agreed to recognize the CB winner as THEIR respective HBCU National Champion. if you don't have buy in from the only 2 hbcu fcs conferences in america, neither disney nor abc or anybody else could "legitimately" claim that the celebration bowl respresents an hbcu "national championship" game, PERIOD. yes, you could still have the celebration bowl without the meac and you could still crown a "mythical" hbcu national champion. but you could not "legitimately" claim that the celebration bowl respresents an hbcu "national championship" game...
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Post by numberonebrave on Sept 23, 2020 16:59:31 GMT -5
So if NCAT , Tenn state or Hampton is ranked #9 at the end of the season in the FCS polls and say the winner of the CB is ranked #24 or not ranked at all or is #3 in the Boxtorow poll, the CB winner should be HBCU Champs?
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Sept 23, 2020 17:22:07 GMT -5
the meac does have plenty of "leverage". if there's no meac, there's no celebration bowl, PERIOD. that's the meac's "leverage". removing the meac from the celebration bowl removes "legitimacy" from the idea that the winner of the celebration bowl will represent hbcu "national" champions. the bowl needs representation from the only 2 hbcu fcs conferences to retain its "legitimacy" to represent an hbcu "national" championship bowl game... In order for the bowl to be legitimate it needs the top teams regardless of conference affiliation. ....but were you saying this before A&T gave any hints of leaving the MEAC? Y’all know good and well that if we were still in the MEAC and either Hampton or Tennessee St was picked over us to participate in the CB because of a higher FCS ranking, y’all would be hot as hell. Don’t even front...this is all being cried about now because....WE’RE LEAVING THE MEAC! This is what you wanted - right?
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Post by Bornthrilla on Sept 23, 2020 17:25:23 GMT -5
Regardless of if A&T is ranked No. 1 in the entire nation, the MEAC and SWAC are both obligated to recognize the Celebration Bowl winner as THEIR HBCU National Champion. This is what I was trying to explain to the FAMU idiots last year.
That is what, in part, made having the Celebration Bowl an attractive venture to Disney in the first place. It would be their way of unifying the HBCU belts (and thus strengthen the marketing power of the event). That is why Jay Walker took such umbrage to FAMU awarding themselves a title because it diminished the value of the CB title brand.
However, if the Celebration Bowl eventually comes to an end, then all bets are off I assume.
Remember, the HBCU National Champion is just a mythical title. The only thing that gives that title legitimacy are the people who vote for it and the people who accept those votes as gospel.
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