|
Post by aggie2039 on Jul 12, 2020 10:24:18 GMT -5
You are a monster. You are putting your family and others at risk just so you can make money. How dare you! haha
|
|
Freeze
Official BDF member
Posts: 2,340
|
Post by Freeze on Jul 12, 2020 11:01:52 GMT -5
Freeze, I didn't say keep everyone on campus safe. I said "safe as possible". That is the calculated risk I have been talking about since this pandemic began; that everyone will eventually have to make. Question: do you honestly believe A&T can go online-only for the next two semesters and not have to suffer massive job losses and a dramatic drop in student enrollment? If you believe we can just weather the storm for another full year and every thing will be honky dory then I will try your plan. However, I don't think there will be a vaccine by December and I dont think we can endure such a financial blow as an HBCU. Based on the data we have available, the probability of students dying from this disease or even suffering longterm health issues simply do no warrant shutting down campus. I agree that would be the safest approach during a pandemic, jut like I agree not leaving your house for any reason is the safest approach during a pandemic. Yet, everyone who is reading this still makes a calculated risk to leave your house everyday during a pandemic. You're operating from a capitalist mindset. I'm operating from a humanitarian/scientific mindset. There is nothing different from what you are saying than from what ultra right wing folks are arguing: Open it up. Assume the risk. There will be casualties. So what. Like I said, some of you wont take it seriously until someone you love or know is admitted into one of these overcrowded hospitals. How American of you. Pretty disappointed in you Thrilla.
|
|
Maxell
Official BDF member
Director of BDF Marketing
Posts: 12,431
|
Post by Maxell on Jul 12, 2020 11:19:47 GMT -5
Freeze, I didn't say keep everyone on campus safe. I said "safe as possible". That is the calculated risk I have been talking about since this pandemic began; that everyone will eventually have to make. Question: do you honestly believe A&T can go online-only for the next two semesters and not have to suffer massive job losses and a dramatic drop in student enrollment? If you believe we can just weather the storm for another full year and every thing will be honky dory then I will try your plan. However, I don't think there will be a vaccine by December and I dont think we can endure such a financial blow as an HBCU. Based on the data we have available, the probability of students dying from this disease or even suffering longterm health issues simply do no warrant shutting down campus. I agree that would be the safest approach during a pandemic, jut like I agree not leaving your house for any reason is the safest approach during a pandemic. Yet, everyone who is reading this still makes a calculated risk to leave your house everyday during a pandemic. You're operating from a capitalist mindset. I'm operating from a humanitarian/scientific mindset. There is nothing different from what you are saying than from what ultra right wing folks are arguing: Open it up. Assume the risk. There will be casualties. So what. Like I said, some of you wont take it seriously until someone you love or know is admitted into one of these overcrowded hospitals. How American of you. Pretty disappointed in you Thrilla. The scientific mindset is: WEAR A DAMN MASK! We understand that much about COVID and folk can't even do that. What are these kids going to do this fall if they are not in school? School is probably a better bubble that staying in their home towns.
|
|
|
Post by Bornthrilla on Jul 12, 2020 11:28:12 GMT -5
How do you know someone I love hasn't been admitted to a hospital for COVID? Please dont make silly assumptions just because people disagree with your viewpoint. Do you honestly think I worry about the health of my family and love ones any less than you worry about your's?
I have been one of the strongest advocates for social distancing and wearing masks since the pandemic began. I have been offering concrete plans on how we can better operate in the midst of this pandemic. I have NEVER thought that shutting everything down until we have a vaccine was a feasible option.
BTW: You can take a "humanitarian/scientific" position all you want when you are still confident that you will be getting the same check each pay period. But once your livelihood is affected you may be prone to take more calculated risks than you are now.
|
|
Freeze
Official BDF member
Posts: 2,340
|
Post by Freeze on Jul 12, 2020 12:21:14 GMT -5
How do you know someone I love hasn't been admitted to a hospital for COVID? Please dont make silly assumptions just because people disagree with your viewpoint. Do you honestly think I worry about the health of my family and love ones any less than you worry about your's? I have been one of the strongest advocates for social distancing and wearing masks since the pandemic began. I have been offering concrete plans on how we can better operate in the midst of this pandemic. I have NEVER thought that shutting everything down until we have a vaccine was a feasible option. BTW: You can take a "humanitarian/scientific" position all you want when you are still confident that you will be getting the same check each pay period. But once your livelihood is affected you may be prone to take more calculated risks than you are now. In my line of work, disagreement is expected and welcomed. Never said that you or anyone on this board have to agree with me and seeking agreement is not why I post on this message board. And my apologies for assuming that you don't have loved ones whose health have been compromised by this virus. It's just that I know folks who have died and have been on ventilators and the tone of your position on this is radically different from those who have suffered in that way. But again...my apologies and peace and healing to your loved ones that have been hospitalized and died from this. Wearing a mask while going to the store once or twice a week to pick up items, or going in to an office that is sparsely populated because that's what expected by your employer is FAR different than trying to run an institution of 12k students whose majority age range is between 18 and 22. That population of kids across the country have not taken this virus seriously and many don't and won't wear masks responsibly or practice social distancing. In fact the trend that we have seen across the country is for many of them to attend parties without masks to see who catches it first...for fun: www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGONKk6GVnkAdditionally, this same age group will come into contact with older faculty, staff, and administrators, many of whom have been designated as being in a higher risk category by the CDC. Reconvening and reopening colleges will be a recipe for disaster. It also sounds like perhaps you and others you know are victims of American capitalism. I get it. Folks are pressed up against the wall and worried about making ends meet. As Americans we have been conditioned to believe that the only way we can conquer this is through the indomitable American work ethic....get out there and take the risk to provide for our families. We often lose sight of the fact that countries around the world approach this vastly different than we do. If you want an enlightening view on how radically different America is I encourage you to read this article that came out in the NY Times last week: www.nytimes.com/2020/07/03/business/economy/europe-us-jobless-coronavirus.htmlIf you can't or don't want to access the article, allow me to present you with the article's central thesis: There's a HUGE history lesson in all of this that I am not inclined to give right now, nor do I believe that many reading this would even care about a "history lesson." Because once again, you are concerned about remaining financially solvent during this crisis....and I get it. But what we really could use and what we really need during this pandemic is a government that is built for taking care of its people and not just giving many of them a one time check for 1,200 bucks and sending them back out to keep the wheels of capitalism grinding so the rich can get richer. We are victims of this. We are all victims of this. And now here we are so worried about the financial futures of our beloved institutions and and our own personal financial well being that we are willing to risk our lives and the lives of others to make that happen when all we really needed was a competent, compassionate government that was built to take care of its people.
|
|
|
Post by Bornthrilla on Jul 12, 2020 12:42:23 GMT -5
I agree, but we obviously do not have that right now. The one thing this administration has proven is that they are both corrupt and incompetent. That is also why I am not confident that they will be able to come up with a vaccine and make it accessible to our communities within the next 12 months.
It sounds like you are basing your argument right now on how you think the country SHOULD operate instead of facing the harsh reality of how it actually DOES operate.
But once again, that is a luxury you might be able to have until it starts to affect your personal paycheck.
|
|
Freeze
Official BDF member
Posts: 2,340
|
Post by Freeze on Jul 12, 2020 14:21:21 GMT -5
I agree, but we obviously do not have that right now. The one thing this administration has proven is that they are both corrupt and incompetent. That is also why I am not confident that they will be able to come up with a vaccine and make it accessible to our communities within the next 12 months. It sounds like you are basing your argument right now on how you think the country SHOULD operate instead of facing the harsh reality of how it actually DOES operate. But once again, that is a luxury you might be able to have until it starts to affect your personal paycheck. No, I'm basing my argument off of having known people who suffered and died from this virus. I'm basing it off of being married to an Emory trained epidemiologist who works on COVID data. And I am basing it off of being a historian who has an understanding of how pandemics have wreaked havoc on American society in the past and how they have particularly impacted people of color and poor people. I am fortunate enough to still collect a paycheck and I empathize with those who are not. But I'm also scared for those who do not HAVE to be tossed into this madness who are now on the cusp of doing so because we want normalcy or (in the case of student athletes) entertainment.
|
|
|
Post by Bornthrilla on Jul 12, 2020 17:54:06 GMT -5
Actually, I am looking for neither normalcy or entertainment. You are making a false argument now because no one here has expressed that. What I am hoping for is to be able to save jobs and continue to educate our students.
This might come as a surprise but there are a ton of staff positions at 1601 E Market Street that can not be performed via a zoom meeting. There are thousands of students who will not be willing to enroll here if the classes are online only.
I totally anticipate having to adapt to a new normal as we learn to operate in the midst of a pandemic. Where you and I disagree is that you believe our university and athletic department will be able to easily bounce back after being shut down for 12 months. I dont share your optimism. Thus, I am willing to take some ugly, imperfect, calculated risks in order to ensure our alma mater does not suffer irreparable harm during this pandemic.
|
|
Freeze
Official BDF member
Posts: 2,340
|
Post by Freeze on Jul 12, 2020 18:38:30 GMT -5
Thus, I am willing to take some ugly, imperfect, calculated risks in order to ensure our alma mater does not suffer irreparable harm during this pandemic. Which includes the possibility of someone from the A&T family dying? Ok homie. Be well and stay safe.
|
|
saabman
Official BDF member
Posts: 11,768
|
Post by saabman on Jul 13, 2020 9:43:54 GMT -5
You're operating from a capitalist mindset. I'm operating from a humanitarian/scientific mindset. There is nothing different from what you are saying than from what ultra right wing folks are arguing: Open it up. Assume the risk. There will be casualties. So what. Like I said, some of you wont take it seriously until someone you love or know is admitted into one of these overcrowded hospitals. How American of you. Pretty disappointed in you Thrilla. The scientific mindset is: WEAR A DAMN MASK! We understand that much about COVID and folk can't even do that. What are these kids going to do this fall if they are not in school? School is probably a better bubble that staying in their home towns. I don't think that you actually believe that yourself " School is probably better bubble then staying in their home towns" come on Maxell . For me it's not about "what are they going to do this fall if they are not in school" Hell what are they going to do ( God forbid) if they contract 19 in a dorm or Apartment far from home . Do you realize that Hospital care units are being over run with patients and some of those same hospitals care providers are now patients. I can not see why you can't see what is trending here ? You want to open our campuses up with minimal testing at best on campus not knowing who is or is not a positive receptor ; with the hope that if any are found to be positive that they can be served under a already over flooded overwhelmed medical system . By opening the campus or campuses in Greensboro your putting Community Spread and it's Spreaders on Steroids . Again I say close down for a semester on line classes only try to get things under control or manageable if not extend the on line courses until a proven cure is found or made available . Also there should be another round of stimulus financial assistance to keep the economy going. Now we will see if the system cares about the students or not . This is to Chancellor Martin. Sir if the UNC system decides to open it's campuses will you stand for the safety of your students or will you stand with the Board and disproportionately put the students at risk.
|
|
Maxell
Official BDF member
Director of BDF Marketing
Posts: 12,431
|
Post by Maxell on Jul 13, 2020 12:25:46 GMT -5
The scientific mindset is: WEAR A DAMN MASK! We understand that much about COVID and folk can't even do that. What are these kids going to do this fall if they are not in school? School is probably a better bubble that staying in their home towns. I don't think that you actually believe that yourself " School is probably better bubble then staying in their home towns" come on Maxell . For me it's not about "what are they going to do this fall if they are not in school" Hell what are they going to do ( God forbid) if they contract 19 in a dorm or Apartment far from home . Do you realize that Hospital care units are being over run with patients and some of those same hospitals care providers are now patients. I can not see why you can't see what is trending here ? You want to open our campuses up with minimal testing at best on campus not knowing who is or is not a positive receptor ; with the hope that if any are found to be positive that they can be served under a already over flooded overwhelmed medical system . By opening the campus or campuses in Greensboro your putting Community Spread and it's Spreaders on Steroids . Again I say close down for a semester on line classes only try to get things under control or manageable if not extend the on line courses until a proven cure is found or made available . Also there should be another round of stimulus financial assistance to keep the economy going. Now we will see if the system cares about the students or not . This is to Chancellor Martin. Sir if the UNC system decides to open it's campuses will you stand for the safety of your students or will you stand with the Board and disproportionately put the students at risk. You do realize the COVID mortality rate in North Carolina is currently less than that of the flu according to the CDC. Don't get fooled by the number of cases alone. Would you shut down campus because of the flu? Plus all of the mitigation and prevention efforts that will be in place. Would the parents of the women's basketball team have sent their girls back to school if they thought they couldn't be safe?
|
|
|
Post by Bornthrilla on Jul 13, 2020 13:14:22 GMT -5
My concern is not only the deaths but the number of people who suffer longterm health issues.
And right now neither of those stats warrant shutting down campus. If those numbers change, I will probably have a different opinion.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2020 15:41:36 GMT -5
My gut says the UNC system is going to go 100% virtual and will announce it within the next 2 weeks.
|
|
Maxell
Official BDF member
Director of BDF Marketing
Posts: 12,431
|
Post by Maxell on Jul 13, 2020 15:51:12 GMT -5
My gut says the UNC system is going to go 100% virtual and will announce it within the next 2 weeks. I don't think so. If all schools go virtual, all of their international students will have their student visas invalidated and they will have to go back to their home countries, based on new rule from ICE.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2020 16:04:42 GMT -5
My gut says the UNC system is going to go 100% virtual and will announce it within the next 2 weeks. I don't think so. If all schools go virtual, all of their international students will have their student visas invalidated and they will have to go back to their home countries, based on new rule from ICE. Harvard and MIT are suing over this and I think they'll win in the lower courts, giving them time to find the loopholes here.
|
|