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Post by durhamgsoaggie on Feb 15, 2020 14:01:19 GMT -5
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saabman
Official BDF member
Posts: 11,714
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Post by saabman on Feb 16, 2020 20:08:06 GMT -5
yeah, i doubt that the "loser" of the celebration bowl would get the same "bump" in enrollment applications as the "winner". kinda reminds me of those buffalo bills teams in the early 90's that went to "4 straight super bowls" and loss every single one of them. no one hardly remembers that buffalo bills team because they loss 4 straight super bowls, most folk don't remember the "runner up" nearly as much as the "winners". i think alcorn having participated in 3 out of 5 celebration bowls but never winning a celebration bowl has the same effect as the buffalo bills losing 4 straight super bowls... Alcorn has been showing continued growth since the Inception of the Celebration Bowl . Not the bump that A&T has shown . Alcorns rural location continues to be problematic but it in coming freshman classes have continue to shown an increase .
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Post by Bornthrilla on Feb 16, 2020 21:48:46 GMT -5
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Post by lobengula on Feb 22, 2020 8:33:02 GMT -5
OSA asked a damn good question. The only way A&T grows from its affiliation with the Big South is if we start getting a deluge......of white/non-black students. Let's keep it real here; black folks know A&T. Are there a few black population pockets in America that ain't familiar with A&T? I guess you could surmise that, but I don't know how well. However, I have a hard time believing that the 22nd century digital network the Big South has that folks are salivating over is what is gonna get those black students to us. What it's gonna do is bring more non-black students to us. Yes, I believe there is more room of growth for A&T; but the question to ask is do we want to have 5000-7000 more minority students on campus or 5000-7000 more majority students on campus? I just don't see where this digital network brings in masses of the former; but there is much more potential for it to bring in masses of the latter. Why? Because A&T is a damn good school that will prepare ANYBODY for a wonderful, prosperous life. A&T prepares you for success - not black-only success - but success. But at the core - A&T was designed to ensure that BLACK FOLKS were given that chance at an education that could lead to a wonderful, prosperous life. Other schools (and if you wanna keep it 100, those in the Big South) weren't giving your an my great grandma and great grandpa educational chances to prepare them for future success. So here we are - 2020. We're moving to the Big South. We're athletically disassociating ourselves from our MEAC brethren. If we still want A&T to continue to grow ---- we really have to ask ourselves how do we want that growth to look.By joining the Big South, I think it's a sign we want more non-black students on our campus to get our enrollment to 20,000 or to whatever arbitrary number the chancellor has in his head. No Celebration Bowl.... No schedules laden with other black schools..... Who are we kidding? This screams of A&T wanting to be "HBCU-lite." Now if that's what you/we want, then say it. To me, this is the big elephant in the room that ain't getting addressed....or folks are too scared to delve into it. We have 12,142 students (per US News: www.usnews.com/best-colleges/north-carolina-at-2905).....28% are students who are first generation college students (ie. THAT'S US). We're 81.1% black (https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges/north-carolina-a-and-t-state-university/student-life/diversity/chart-ethnic-diversity.html) I don't see where we get to nearly 20,000 students in the future......with it still being 81.1% black. It could remain predominantly black, but 80% black??? More like 60-65% black (ie. greater influx of non-black students). So for all who are clamoring for the move to the Big South and who are clamoring for further growth at A&T ---- I think you need to clarify how you envision that "GROWTH" to look like. From a demographic standpoint, if we get greater growth, I can't see where the Big South affiliation leads to us having the same type of demographic (ie. black student) growth that we've had over the past 10 years. I honestly seeing us looking more and more HBCU-lite as the years go by. If that's what you want - cool. I see this move as an inevitability of A&T looking more and more "HBCU-lite" as the decades pass. Do you? . Perhaps you may need to peruse the historic mandate of A&T as well other similar schools. Basically we have exceeded that mandate which was never in the plan. It was the protests of HBCUs that enhanced the landscape of the country. Now it is apparent that we are in another phase of inhibiting our growth. We need classroom buildings. The school of Nanotechnology should be the impetus to take us to the Preeminence level.
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Maxell
Official BDF member
Director of BDF Marketing
Posts: 12,398
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Post by Maxell on Feb 22, 2020 23:44:46 GMT -5
OSA asked a damn good question. The only way A&T grows from its affiliation with the Big South is if we start getting a deluge......of white/non-black students. Let's keep it real here; black folks know A&T. Are there a few black population pockets in America that ain't familiar with A&T? I guess you could surmise that, but I don't know how well. However, I have a hard time believing that the 22nd century digital network the Big South has that folks are salivating over is what is gonna get those black students to us. What it's gonna do is bring more non-black students to us. Yes, I believe there is more room of growth for A&T; but the question to ask is do we want to have 5000-7000 more minority students on campus or 5000-7000 more majority students on campus? I just don't see where this digital network brings in masses of the former; but there is much more potential for it to bring in masses of the latter. Why? Because A&T is a damn good school that will prepare ANYBODY for a wonderful, prosperous life. A&T prepares you for success - not black-only success - but success. But at the core - A&T was designed to ensure that BLACK FOLKS were given that chance at an education that could lead to a wonderful, prosperous life. Other schools (and if you wanna keep it 100, those in the Big South) weren't giving your an my great grandma and great grandpa educational chances to prepare them for future success. So here we are - 2020. We're moving to the Big South. We're athletically disassociating ourselves from our MEAC brethren. If we still want A&T to continue to grow ---- we really have to ask ourselves how do we want that growth to look.By joining the Big South, I think it's a sign we want more non-black students on our campus to get our enrollment to 20,000 or to whatever arbitrary number the chancellor has in his head. No Celebration Bowl.... No schedules laden with other black schools..... Who are we kidding? This screams of A&T wanting to be "HBCU-lite." Now if that's what you/we want, then say it. To me, this is the big elephant in the room that ain't getting addressed....or folks are too scared to delve into it. We have 12,142 students (per US News: www.usnews.com/best-colleges/north-carolina-at-2905).....28% are students who are first generation college students (ie. THAT'S US). We're 81.1% black (https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges/north-carolina-a-and-t-state-university/student-life/diversity/chart-ethnic-diversity.html) I don't see where we get to nearly 20,000 students in the future......with it still being 81.1% black. It could remain predominantly black, but 80% black??? More like 60-65% black (ie. greater influx of non-black students). So for all who are clamoring for the move to the Big South and who are clamoring for further growth at A&T ---- I think you need to clarify how you envision that "GROWTH" to look like. From a demographic standpoint, if we get greater growth, I can't see where the Big South affiliation leads to us having the same type of demographic (ie. black student) growth that we've had over the past 10 years. I honestly seeing us looking more and more HBCU-lite as the years go by. If that's what you want - cool. I see this move as an inevitability of A&T looking more and more "HBCU-lite" as the decades pass. Do you? . Perhaps you may need to peruse the historic mandate of A&T as well other similar schools. Basically we have exceeded that mandate which was never in the plan. It was the protests of HBCUs that enhanced the landscape of the country. Now it is apparent that we are in another phase of inhibiting our growth. We need classroom buildings. The school of Nanotechnology should be the impetus to take us to the Preeminence level. How do I see the growth? 1. I do not see growth just in terms of students enrolled, especially to 20,000 students. Our infrastructure can't handle it right now. I think the target should be 15,000 students which is only a few thousand more than we currently have. We build through a combination of traditional students, non-traditional students(older adults), online students,and graduate students. 2. High Point is already in the Greensboro academic consortium but the Big South commissioner mentioned academic agreements among conference schools which may expand the student pool for special programs or summer school at A&T for the other three NC schools(Campbell, UNC-A and Gardner-Webb)as well as the closer Va.and SC schools. 3. An overlooked benefit may revolve around faculty and staff. New conference affiliation will expose A&T and its programs to a different pool of potential faculty and staff. This is particularly important as we move toward stated goals for doctoral research and collaboration. It can also expose A&T to new funding sources in the private sector that would have never known about A&T. Most of our research funding comes from the federal government and large corporations but there are other pockets of private funding and foundations that are waiting to be explored. 4. Martin will begin to build relationships with another set of presidents which will open doors that we can't predict. For example: I could see connections with additional employers or grad schools to enhance post graduate opportunities for our non-technical majors. That's how I see growth. And quite frankly none of these things would disrupt the look and feel of the core A&T experience and could actually enhance it.
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Post by oldschool on Feb 23, 2020 2:33:55 GMT -5
I've read in several of the Aggie Preeminence plans that have been in circulation for years that our goal was to have approx 30% non african american enrollment by a certain year ,so that shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone .
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Feb 23, 2020 12:07:32 GMT -5
I've read in several of the Aggie Preeminence plans that have been in circulation for years that our goal was to have approx 30% non african american enrollment by a certain year ,so that shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone . So if that's the goal, but we still are only at <15-20% non-African American, you're telling me that joining a PWI-based conference is not a means by helping us getting closer to reaching this goal? Again, I AM NOT THE ONE WHO BRINGS UP DEMOGRAPHICS IN THE DISCUSSION...... Aggie Preeminence Goal ------ 30% non-African American students.....BY 2023.....hello Aggie Nation, it's FEBRUARY 2020 - we got LESS THAN 3 YEARS to hit these benchmarks!!
Here is A&T currently ----- Check the different websites. We are currently anywhere between 81.1% -84% black/African-American. I've heard ALL the reasons about why we've moved to the Big South (less travel expenses, higher profile, stronger competition). Now listen to me...... Does A&T have a better chance achieving a 30%-non black/AA population by 2023 by: A) Staying in the MEAC B) Moving to the Big South It may not be the primary reason why we're moving......but sometimes "pleasant side effects" arise when you're taking medication for other reasons. It's like taking Minoxidil to keep your blood pressure under control......yet you start to see more hair growth on your head as you take it.......that's what's called a "pleasant side effect." It's like taking Viagra for high blood pressure and chest pain.......do I have to explain the "pleasant side effect" that happens after taking the blue pill? Read this please: ncatregister.com/14084/the-yard/where-will-n-c-at-be-in-5-years/This article was written in 2018.....but here it is - 2020, and we're as black as we've ever been. So, by 2023....14,000 students, 30% to be non-black/AA. I think we're doing okay with the 14,000 goal......that 30% goal though? hmmmmm..... Once again.....I ponder if people are downplaying the "pleasant side effects" A&T may feel from taking the "Big South blue pill."
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Post by aggie2039 on Feb 23, 2020 12:26:21 GMT -5
I've read in several of the Aggie Preeminence plans that have been in circulation for years that our goal was to have approx 30% non african american enrollment by a certain year ,so that shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone . So if that's the goal, but we still are only at <15-20% non-African American, you're telling me that joining a PWI-based conference is not a means by helping us getting closer to reaching this goal? Again, I AM NOT THE ONE WHO BRINGS UP DEMOGRAPHICS IN THE DISCUSSION...... Aggie Preeminence Goal ------ 30% non-African American students.....BY 2023.....hello Aggie Nation, it's FEBRUARY 2020 - we got LESS THAN 3 YEARS to hit these benchmarks!!
Here is A&T currently ----- Check the different websites. We are currently anywhere between 81.1% -84% black/African-American. I've heard ALL the reasons about why we've moved to the Big South (less travel expenses, higher profile, stronger competition). Now listen to me...... Does A&T have a better chance achieving a 30%-non black/AA population by 2023 by: A) Staying in the MEAC B) Moving to the Big South It may not be the primary reason why we're moving......but sometimes "pleasant side effects" arise when you're taking medication for other reasons. It's like taking Minoxidil to keep your blood pressure under control......yet you start to see more hair growth on your head as you take it.......that's what's called a "pleasant side effect." It's like taking Viagra for high blood pressure and chest pain.......do I have to explain the "pleasant side effect" that happens after taking the blue pill? Read this please: ncatregister.com/14084/the-yard/where-will-n-c-at-be-in-5-years/This article was written in 2018.....but here it is - 2020, and we're as black as we've ever been. So, by 2023....14,000 students, 30% to be non-black/AA. I think we're doing okay with the 14,000 goal......that 30% goal though? hmmmmm..... Once again.....I ponder if people are downplaying the "pleasant side effects" A&T may feel from taking the "Big South blue pill." Why does it even matter if A&T is 30 percent non AA? Diversity isn’t a one way street...people complain about lack of diversity at corporations but it’s ok if HBCUs aren’t diverse. If all of a sudden black kids decide not to attend A&T because we are not in the MEAC then we don’t need them. Academics comes first and is the only reason why we exist, let’s not forget we are an academic institution first. UNCG has more black students than a lot of MEAC and CIAA schools. Kids have options if we want to continue to grow or even maintain or enrollment we must pull for a bigger pool of candidates. Just like building wealth, people diversify their portfolio in order to increase the odds of growth and protect against one stock losing value. In this case only counting on black students to enroll in our institutions does not shield us from the ups and downs of the market. Black kids have a lot of options and live in more integrated neighborhoods and attend diverse high schools. If we don’t adapt we die.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Feb 23, 2020 12:49:12 GMT -5
We've been black for nearly 130 years.....our enrollment continues to grow......yet, you end by saying if we don't adapt, we die. If the growth on the campus of A&T over the past decade is what death looks like, we need to start serving cyanide cocktails in the new student union.
Please dude, you cannot be this naive. "Academics comes first and is the only reason why we exist, let’s not forget we are an academic institution first."
Academics......for whom? Do your research - what was A&T originally called? The A and M College for the Colored Race
A&T wasn't initially just called "The A and M College." Again, it was called "The A and M College........FOR THE COLORED RACE."
UNC was founded in 1789.... NC State was founded in 1887....
Assuming you're black, was your great-great-great-great grandmother/grandfather one of the first students at those institutions? If not, why?
The only reason why we exist is because institutions of higher learning were not made for us.......if my ancestors were in the first few classes at UNC or NC St, that "A and M College for the Colored Race" would have never come to fruition.
And now you know......THE REST OF THE STORY.
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Post by aggie2039 on Feb 23, 2020 12:56:52 GMT -5
We've been black for nearly 130 years.....our enrollment continues to grow......yet, you end by saying if we don't adapt, we die. If the growth on the campus of A&T over the past decade is what death looks like, we need to start serving cyanide cocktails in the new student union. Please dude, you cannot be this naive. "Academics comes first and is the only reason why we exist, let’s not forget we are an academic institution first." Academics......for whom? Do your research - what was A&T originally called? The A and M College for the Colored RaceA&T wasn't initially just called "The A and M College." Again, it was called "The A and M College........FOR THE COLORED RACE." UNC was founded in 1789.... NC State was founded in 1887.... Assuming you're black, was your great-great-great-great grandmother/grandfather one of the first students at those institutions? If not, why? The only reason why we exist is because institutions of higher learning were not made for us.......if my ancestors were in the first few classes at UNC or NC St, that "A and M College for the Colored Race" would have never come to fruition. And now you know......THE REST OF THE STORY. Again, why does it matter that we are 30 percent non AA? How about this, since you don’t like diversity move into an all black neighborhood, send your kids to all black schools and quit your diverse job. I
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Post by aggie2039 on Feb 23, 2020 13:06:38 GMT -5
www.famu.edu/BOT/1%20BOT%20Budget%20Workshop%202020%20rev%202-20-20z-1.pdfLook at slide 22 which outlines FAMUs strategic goals. They want to diversify their student population! Leaders of our institutions understand the benefits of diversity and the competition for talented AA students. Leaders of both A&T and FAMU are in positions of leadership and highly regarded because they understand the big picture and are doing what it takes to move both institutions forward. We don’t want to be known as the top HBCU but as one of the top universities in the nation.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Feb 23, 2020 13:07:32 GMT -5
I'm not arguing what percentage of non-black folks should be on campus. I'm just incredulous with how people seemingly want to act as if we're not hoping to ascertain some type of "pleasant side effect" within our demographics with our new Big South affiliation.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Feb 23, 2020 13:09:20 GMT -5
www.famu.edu/BOT/1%20BOT%20Budget%20Workshop%202020%20rev%202-20-20z-1.pdfLook at slide 22 which outlines FAMUs strategic goals. They want to diversify their student population! Leaders of our institutions understand the benefits of diversity and the competition for talented AA students. Leaders of both A&T and FAMU are in positions of leadership and highly regarded because they understand the big picture and are doing what it takes to move both institutions forward. We don’t want to be known as the top HBCU but as one of the top universities in the nation. FAMU needs to join the Big South... By the way, to interject FAMU into this discussion really makes no sense.
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Post by aggie2039 on Feb 23, 2020 13:11:28 GMT -5
I'm not arguing what percentage of non-black folks should be on campus. I'm just incredulous with how people seemingly want to act as if we're not hoping to ascertain some type of "pleasant side effect" within our demographics with our new Big South affiliation. Copy all, honestly I think the diversity will come in our grad schools. Undergrad will not be effected as much by the moves. With our grad schools those BS schools with only undergrad engineering programs could become feeders for our masters and PHD programs. I think the same will happen for our undergrads to get into professional schools at high point and Campbell
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Post by aggie2039 on Feb 23, 2020 13:13:14 GMT -5
www.famu.edu/BOT/1%20BOT%20Budget%20Workshop%202020%20rev%202-20-20z-1.pdfLook at slide 22 which outlines FAMUs strategic goals. They want to diversify their student population! Leaders of our institutions understand the benefits of diversity and the competition for talented AA students. Leaders of both A&T and FAMU are in positions of leadership and highly regarded because they understand the big picture and are doing what it takes to move both institutions forward. We don’t want to be known as the top HBCU but as one of the top universities in the nation. FAMU needs to join the Big South... By the way, to interject FAMU into this discussion really makes no sense. I placed FAMU in the conversation to show that another HBCU is trying to diversify their enrollment not just A&T.
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