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Post by Aggie Monster on Apr 16, 2009 10:57:16 GMT -5
Just to add a little. Currently, regardless of what people may think. The MEAC is not looked at as a lesser conference within the FCS by athletes.
The MEAC schools(including A&T) just do a poor job of promoting self and conference to these athletes. We are already at a disadvantage cause most white kids wont come to the MEAC, so they have ot do better at making these guys(the black ones) think we are better for them than the Elons, Woffords, etc.....
We do that by making smart decisions for coaches first. Coaches make these programs into well oiled machines and the MEAC will win a FCS championship easy.
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oleschoolaggie
Official BDF member
2009 Poster of the Year, 2009 Most Knowledgeable Poster
Posts: 24,207
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Apr 16, 2009 11:47:59 GMT -5
Now Oleschool, none of the conferences you listed are producing very many NFL players anymore. That’s because few of the participants of the conferences spend anything on recruiting. Statistically speaking, I would expect a conference that gives more scholarships to have more guys with an opportunity, wouldn’t you? yes, that would be my expectation. but that also supports the argument that meac/swac talent is better than ciaa/siac talent. if we've got more schollies, then logic says we've got more talent. no athlete will turn down a d1 scholly to compete at a less competitive d2 level without a scholly. and most athletes who are capable of competing at the fcs level will pay his own way to an fcs school before he pays his way to a d2 school. more schollies, more talent, more depth, more respect, equates to better d1 talent than d2 talent... Again, if we are recruiting the same athletes, they have the same talent. They’re the SAME athletes. We’ve had guys transfer to A&T from d-2 schools and start immediately. And not just one or two either. i disagree. we are not recruiting the same athletes and there are fbs athletes who started at the fbs level (larry coker, tenn) that didn't start and had less numbers at the fcs level (hampton). sure there's some overlap where we may recruit some of the same athletes that d2 schools recruit. but there's also overlap where we recruit some of the same athletes that bcs schools recruit and d2's don't. that's why our 27 game "winless" football team had no trouble whatsoever beating a 4 win jcsu d2 team. Oleschool, here’s question to demonstrate my point. In a game between Tuskeegee and SC State, who do you think would win? I honestly cannot say for sure. That alone tells me that the difference in talent ain’t great. dooms, you've got to be kidding! i know for sure who would win that game! it would be a complete blowout, scsu would win! i've seen tuskeegee play "twice" on tv and their games looked like high school games. they had a good qb (atkinson) that dominated the game but the execution "literally" looked like pickup ball! it was horrible! made me wonder if they were even running plays! dooms, it would not be a close game! ain't no way in hail tuskeegee could challenge app state in boone the way scsu did. ain't no way! scsu would "kill" tuskeegee!!! I’ve brought this up a lot over the years when people insult or downplay d-2. In 1994, defending I-AA national champion Youngstown State played defending d-2 national champion University of North Alabama in Youngstown. Both YSU and UNA went on to win another national championship in their respective divisions that year. The final score was 17-14, YSU. Three points separated the best in I-AA from the best in d-2. YSU was 14-0-1 that year. UNA was 14-1 I think. Three points. UNA played YSU closer than I-A Akron, I-A Kent State, Montana, Umass, Steve McNair led Alcorn State, and everybody else they played with the exception of two teams. dooms, that's a bunch of bull shigidy you're talkin' my friend!! using that logic, app state should have been ranked in the bcs top 10 and the fcs proclaimed as good as the fbs since app state beat a top 10 michigan in their house. texas southern, one of the absolute "worst" teams in the swac, beat shaw univ. who was the defending ciaa champions. if a&t suddenly got switched to the ciaa this summer and we're allowed to keep all our players, we'd win the ciaa championship this year! whereas in the meac, we'll be lucky if we finish in the middle of the pack. so you can't use single games as an example of the talent level between d1 and d2. all it proves is that on a specific day one team was better than the other. it doesn't prove anything relevant to talent level between classifications.
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Post by Aggie Monster on Apr 16, 2009 14:24:49 GMT -5
we would be a favorite to win the CIAA, LOL
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Post by DOOMS on Apr 17, 2009 8:28:11 GMT -5
Oleschool, I can only agree we (should) have more talent by extension of the fact that we have more schollys to give. But my point is our talent is no more talented.
As far as your disagreeing concerning the athletes we recruit, you can disagree with me on it but you can't (or at least shouldn't) disagree with the truth. The truth is if you've looked at the recruits we've gotten over the years you've seen the schools that were recruiting them listed. I noticed a very long time ago (1990 to be exact) that the lion's share of the kids we recruited were also recruited by the local d-2 schools. It has been that way for years and it will continue to be that way. We are recruiting the same athletes. Accept it.
I noticed you used how badly we beat JCSU as an example. Bad example considering d-2 Virginia State, Virginia Union, and Shaw beat them just as bad, and Fayetteville State beat them far worse.
I'm also kind of incredulous that you think SC State would mop the floor with Tuskeegee. But I'll let you believe what you want to believe on that one.
I'm failing to understand how you can take the proven historical facts I typed concerning the YSU vs. UNA game and term it "bull shiggidy." The facts surrounding that season and those games are incontrovertable. The logic that concerns the difference in talent level does not extend (generally) to the difference in talent level between I-A and I-AA. The differences between the two are astounding.
There was a reason I included evidence of YSU's consistent performance throughout that season in addition to providing the score from the game. I included it because I knew somebody would say it was a fluke.
Fellas it's like I've said, this is an issue built on emotion and lacking logic. Emotions will lead you to ignore facts because emotionally you don't want to accept the facts. But you don't have to worry because it won't happen.
What will happen is the MEAC will eventually do like the SWAC.
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Post by Bornthrilla on Apr 17, 2009 8:35:32 GMT -5
I don't understand that point. We also recruit a ton of athletes who are recruited by D1-A schools. Most of them end up signing with the D1-A schools, mind you, but every HBCU has been able to steal a few from time to time. Likewise, I am sure many D2 schools have been able to steal a few kids who were recruited by MEAC teams. So what? Just because a lower school tries to recruit you does not necessarily diminish your talent or ability.
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Post by DOOMS on Apr 17, 2009 9:00:28 GMT -5
I don't understand that point. We also recruit a ton of athletes who are recruited by D1-A schools. Most of them signing with the D1-A schools, mind you, but every HBCU has been able to steal a few from time to time. Likewise, I am sure many D2 schools have been able to steal a few kids who were recruited by MEAC teams. So what? Just because a lower school tries to recruit you does not necessarily diminish your talent or ability. EXACTLY! But I addressed your other points in a previous post concerning the order in which a kid generally looks to go to school.
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oleschoolaggie
Official BDF member
2009 Poster of the Year, 2009 Most Knowledgeable Poster
Posts: 24,207
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Post by oleschoolaggie on Apr 17, 2009 11:07:06 GMT -5
Oleschool, I can only agree we (should) have more talent by extension of the fact that we have more schollys to give. But my point is our talent is no more talented. As far as your disagreeing concerning the athletes we recruit, you can disagree with me on it but you can't (or at least shouldn't) disagree with the truth. The truth is if you've looked at the recruits we've gotten over the years you've seen the schools that were recruiting them listed. I noticed a very long time ago (1990 to be exact) that the lion's share of the kids we recruited were also recruited by the local d-2 schools. It has been that way for years and it will continue to be that way. We are recruiting the same athletes. Accept it. I noticed you used how badly we beat JCSU as an example. Bad example considering d-2 Virginia State, Virginia Union, and Shaw beat them just as bad, and Fayetteville State beat them far worse. I'm also kind of incredulous that you think SC State would mop the floor with Tuskeegee. But I'll let you believe what you want to believe on that one. I'm failing to understand how you can take the proven historical facts I typed concerning the YSU vs. UNA game and term it "bull shiggidy." The facts surrounding that season and those games are incontrovertable. The logic that concerns the difference in talent level does not extend (generally) to the difference in talent level between I-A and I-AA. The differences between the two are astounding. There was a reason I included evidence of YSU's consistent performance throughout that season in addition to providing the score from the game. I included it because I knew somebody would say it was a fluke. Fellas it's like I've said, this is an issue built on emotion and lacking logic. Emotions will lead you to ignore facts because emotionally you don't want to accept the facts. But you don't have to worry because it won't happen. What will happen is the MEAC will eventually do like the SWAC. dooms, as reported by the news and observer ( www.newsobserver.com/167/story/309723.html), the MEAC currently has 29 players in the NFL; the CIAA has two. and you think the talent is the same at the d2 level as it is at the fcs level? i'm not a lawyer but my friend, i rest my case...and absolutely yes, scsu would drag tuskeegee all up and down the friggin' football field! scsu is much bigger, faster, and much deeper than tuskeegee. if amanti couldn't dominate scsu, ain't no way in hail atkinson could. dooms, you're really trippin' if you think tuskeegee is on scsu's level. i know you favor d2, but let's not be delusional about the facts...
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