saabman
Official BDF member
Posts: 11,714
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Post by saabman on Dec 22, 2014 13:36:12 GMT -5
Hear. Hear. Your statement is truthful. And I will say it most MEAC fans do not give one D cent about the FCS playoff. HELL most don't give a D about there own teams. We played on ESPN and we could not feel Aggie stadium and you think the fans would give a Flip about a FCS playoff game please ! ...but people would pack it in for a Jim Crow Bowl? Most people here said that they don't give a flying flip about the FCS Playoffs when we (A&T) aren't in it. What makes you think that people will give a flying flip about DelState and Mississippi Valley playing in the Chitlin' Bowl a couple of days before Christmas?? The problem is really not with the FCS Playoffs...the problem is with US!!We don't give back enough to do what Hilton and Martin need to bid on a first round playoff game. Yes, we have the POTENTIAL to do exactly what North Dakota State is doing, but we don't follow through with monetary support and physical commitment to get there. We are putting a good product on-the-field, but now y'all think that we should QUIT and play the SWAC instead of continuing to build on what has been created out of the ashes of an 0-27 run and APR disaster just a few seasons ago. THAT MAKES NO SENSE, MY AGGIE BROTHERS!!No we didn't say Quit. Hilton Quit along with the rest of the MEAC power heads. No one knew this was coming even back in Aug it was just a passing post that we just commented on and moved on. Now it out of the box and opinions are flowing and we still don't no the why's and how's of this mess. Hilton needs to put his Big Boy pants on and tell us AGGIES what the H is the reasoning behind all of this.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Dec 22, 2014 13:43:39 GMT -5
AggieRattler, What I'm typing and what you're interpretting are 2 different things.... I'vE openly stated I want us to compete (AND WIN) in the FCS playoffs. There's nothing "Jim Crow" about what I've stated. There's no "quitter mentality" to what I stated. I really don't see where you're getting this from..... I just don't believe in competing anymore......I believe in winning. If we win an MEAC title in the near future, but don't even submit a financial bid to host a first round game.......WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT WHAT OUR ATHLETIC DEPT'S THOUGHTS ON PLAYOFF SUCCESS? ? There's talk (ie. I want to compete in the playoffs)..... Then there is action (ie. Paying the money to host a game at Aggie Stadium)...... If we aren't going to submit a bid to host a game and force the team to bus it to another university's field and expect them to win......THAT IS NOT ENOUGH OF A WINNING COMMITMENT FROM OUR ATHLETIC PROGRAM. I really don't see how this can be interpretted as a Jim Crow or a quitter mentality..... Either the athletic dept does everything in its power to enhance our playoff victory chances or consider a plan B. When you're asking the team to bus it to a Coastal Carolina, Richmond, James Madison to play a game.......my interpretation is YOU'RE INTERESTED IN COMPETING, BUT NOT NECESSARILY WINNING.....
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saabman
Official BDF member
Posts: 11,714
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Post by saabman on Dec 22, 2014 13:44:20 GMT -5
That's Low man don't even go there with that BS ok. .AR you have Hilton's hear . Why don't you send that exact statement to him.NHSS just stated what was on his mind that just happen to be the truth and I agree with him 100%. Because a man shows Reason doesn't make the man a Quitter. This is about a flipping football game . Dam SAABMAN-- This was not a personal attack on NSS (or anybody else), and you know that! In fact, over the years, he and I have agreed on many issues. I counter-attacked his words and opinions... not him. And I have the right to disagree with anyone concerning any issue, including you. And you have the same rights, too. So, let's get that straight, ok? Bro I'm cool with that nothing but a thing. Lol. I'm just wondering why Hilton has not stepped up and made some typeof statement on this. If anyone's a Quitter it maybe him.
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Post by Aggie One on Dec 22, 2014 14:21:28 GMT -5
A lot of assumptions and finger pointing are being made on a premise of a bowl game that has yet to be verified by either an official chancellor/president's meeting, the absence of any verifiable offer by a major sponsor or a any vote of the conference membership other than what came up in the usual rumor mills on message boards which may or may not be based on anything that is factual.
Seems to be awfully premature to speculate on people's supposed motives and positions on an potential issue without any actual concrete facts or context from which to draw such conclusions.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Dec 22, 2014 14:36:27 GMT -5
I don't disagree with you one bit Aggie One. I want to see some official documentation, personally. But even with that said, I do believe we need to be very specific about what our intentions/aspirations are when it comes to the FCS playoffs.....
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Post by DOOMS on Dec 22, 2014 14:50:03 GMT -5
Personally I'd like to see us put on lil boy pants and go to d-2 and finish the job that WSSU couldn't.
I know I'm in the complete minority on that one, but if we would be willing to keep the budget where it is right now and make the move we could dominate the division.
We could double our budget and not make much more of a dent in division I than we're already making. The high point of our program in the past 10 years is that we lost by an extra point to a team that was ranked #1 (and shouldn't have been) at one point during the season.
The high point of our program over the past 20 years is that we beat the #1 ranked team in the first round of the playoffs (and they shouldn't have been ranked #1 either).
The high point of the program over the past 30 years is that we were ranked #5 at one point in 1993.
At the end of the day if we ain't hoisting flags none of that is a big deal. We're not willing or able to scrounge up the serious change it would take to hoist flags, so why keep wasting everybody's time?
There's about zero chance I would go to heritage bowl redux. I went to one where SC Steat got smothered by Southern, and it was boring. After that I rarely even watched them on tv. I'm much more likely to go to a playoff game. I'm also more likely to go to a d-3 game if it's nearby because I'm a college football fan, period. Since I'm in the minority on that one I suspect my opinion doesn't count.
I suspect that the opinion of the majority is what will count to the decision-makers. The majority wants to see a band and wear nice outfits and go to an afterparty. The majority will want the HondaBowl!!!!
I understand that Chancellor Martin has some dream that we can be nationally competitive. If so, he's going to have to make some hard decisions. First of all, we don't spend nearly enough on the program to be nationally competitive in division I. And no, losing by a point to somebody doesn't make you nationally competitive. The MEAC is not going to make us nationally competitive. Neither would the Big South. We don't spend nearly enough to even be considered by the SoCon.
When I first heard the news, I was heartbroken. But then I realized we ain't kicking up no dust as it stands anyways. So I just shrug my shoulders and see how it plays out.
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Post by aggierattler on Dec 22, 2014 14:54:32 GMT -5
I don't disagree with you one bit Aggie One. I want to see some official documentation, personally. But even with that said, I do believe we need to be very specific about what our intentions/aspirations are when it comes to the FCS playoffs..... I agree with this 100%.
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Post by marchingband1969 on Dec 22, 2014 15:40:32 GMT -5
I must have missed the University's press release officially announcing all of these changes. I'm not doubting that this "may have" happened but until the "official" word is released, I think it's a bit premature to start speculating what will or will not happen. And it sure is too soon to start blaming AD Hilton or questioning why they are not releasing more details. Based on this thread, the more information we have the wilder the speculations are. For the past two days there's been crazy claims, racial slurs and hostile confrontations over a "rumor!" Why not just calm down and wait to see and hear what has really transpired.
I grew up in the 1960's when we were regularly lied to by "the man" and didn't trust anyone...so like a lot of you, I'm always skeptical. But could we just wait to get the "official" word before we storm AD Hilton's office and run him out of town for selling us out? I want to see the "facts" first before I start speculating what will happen.
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Post by neighborhoodsuperstar on Dec 22, 2014 15:41:53 GMT -5
Dooms, If we went down to DII, wouldn't our scholarships get reduced to 36?? If we decided to participate in the DII playoffs and wanted a home game - don't we still have to pay money to host a home game??
Dropping down a division may ease up some monetary issues, but when it comes to the playoffs, similar concerns would still exist. Again, WHERE DO WE STAND WHEN IT COMES TO OUR SERIOUSNESS ABOUT WINNING IN THE PLAYOFFS.....REGARDLESS OF THE DIVISION.
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Post by DOOMS on Dec 22, 2014 15:47:07 GMT -5
NSS, that's why I said if we kept the budget where it is right now.
We'd have more money for infrastructure and recruitment and retention. And wouldn't have to spend as much on schollys as you point out.
Our problem is in a nutshell, money. It has been for eons. In division II the same money we're spending now could go a lot further. Like, nationally further.
As far as your repeated questions about bidding for a home game, I'm pretty sure I read in a thread somewhere around here that we didn't bid this year because Hilton wanted to get his feet wet in the playoff committee and see what it was like before making that decision.
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KidHeartless
Official BDF member
AGGIE FRIGGIN PRIDE!
Posts: 1,814
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Post by KidHeartless on Dec 22, 2014 17:46:39 GMT -5
im 100% playoffs
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Post by ohsixrain on Dec 22, 2014 19:10:27 GMT -5
For those of you that want to continue as we have been, which amounts to swinging blindfold at a baseball, I can understand your argument. But, you guys really don't demonstrate what is so advantageous about us competing in the playoffs. Does it help recruiting, maybe but, not to the level that one would anticipate. Do we get a participation pay out? Not if our fans don't show up the Saturday after Thanksgiving provided we are in position to host a playoff game...afterwhich we pay $30 grand. So, what are the advantages...we could possibly win a championship! Okay, I get that and real talk, we are light years away. But anywayz.
Now, flip the pancake, if there is a guarantee associated with the HBCU bowl game, you tell me why we shouldn't consider? I don't think anyone has a money tree they can go shake out back and that always seems to be our biggest challenge. So.
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Post by aggieepower1990 on Dec 22, 2014 20:00:08 GMT -5
AD Hilton and Chancellor Martin have some tough decisions to make, if these rumors of a HBCU National Championship game are true (I'm not convinced that they are). I'm torn between being a part of the FCS and being a part of Black College Football. I disagree that participating in a HBCU National Championship game is Jim Crowish. To me Jim Crow is when you have no choice about the matter and it is imposed on you. Agreeing to play would be a proactive decision. I wonder if both the SWAC and the MEAC agreed to play in the prestigious well attended FCS playoffs and somehow began to dominate the FCS playoffs, what would the NCAA and the other conferences do? My guess is that they may contemplate changing the rules to stay on top or form their own self-proclaimed-championship game. Look at the the threats the SEC made to the NCAA about having their own national championship game. No matter what the decision, there will be fall out. Personally, I lean towards the FCS playoffs because of the "apparent" inclusion into American society, however. If the HBCU National Championship is creative and looks to a modern marketing plan/strategy for our community, it could be big. If the 'same ole same ole' are calling the shots, my guess is that they may be a little out of touch with what will sell. There is a chance that theHBCU National Championship game could be bigger than the FCS playoffs, maybe not a better brand of football but a more entertaining game. A&T has always played Black College Football. If we were to go to another conference, we had better store up the war chest for the unknown road ahead.
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Post by DOOMS on Dec 23, 2014 7:48:23 GMT -5
That's my thing.
We have a good product, although it is woefully underfinanced. We ALL know that if we put our product where we have financed it, there would be maybe two HBCUs still in division I. Maybe. Meanwhile there'd be a large number in division II and a large number in division III.
...AND WE'D BE RUNNING BOTH DIVISIONS...
Or we'd all be in the NAIA and we could recruit the students we were actually meant to serve in the first place without worrying about NCAA rules that are detrimental to our missions. And the NAIA would gain IMMEDIATE legitimacy from the large number of schools added. And there'd be no more of this "we ain't playing y'all because y'all wear lil boy pants" mess, because we'd all be in the same division.
The more I think about it, NAIA wouldn't be a bad idea...
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Post by durhamgsoaggie on Dec 23, 2014 8:36:06 GMT -5
That's my thing. We have a good product, although it is woefully underfinanced. We ALL know that if we put our product where we have financed it, there would be maybe two HBCUs still in division I. Maybe. Meanwhile there'd be a large number in division II and a large number in division III. ...AND WE'D BE RUNNING BOTH DIVISIONS... Or we'd all be in the NAIA and we could recruit the students we were actually meant to serve in the first place without worrying about NCAA rules that are detrimental to our missions. And the NAIA would gain IMMEDIATE legitimacy from the large number of schools added. And there'd be no more of this "we ain't playing y'all because y'all wear lil boy pants" mess, because we'd all be in the same division. The more I think about it, NAIA wouldn't be a bad idea... It's both an indictment and a gut-check on us as a collective group and where we choose to put our money. It's inexcusable that only 1% of our alums donate to athletics when the larger PWIs are at 15-20% and that for decades, our athletics have been funded on the backs of our kids in the form of student athletic fees. Whether we're in FCS, DII, DIII or NAIA, that issue won't change. If we move down, we'll just be excusing the behavior from the adults. And I don't think we'd drawn the same caliber of players if we move down. Just watch WSSU in a few years after having to deal with APR. It's not as though the black community doesn't have residual money (especially educated folks). We put $15 billion a year into black churches in the US. $9 billion goes into black women's hair care alone. Billions more goes into other entertainment streams. It's a free country and folks have a right to do what they want with their money. It just irks me to see that one group of people gets it.... and the group that I'm in doesn't. I haven't given up on getting us to properly pool resources together to do big things.... but I see why a lot of folks don't even bother....
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